June 8, 1967 Alameda County Zodiac Victims??

Worst of all, is that police lost many of their records over the years when they moved locations. This case was one of the records they lost. We were lucky that they still had the bullets. I am waiting to see if any of the Family has any copies of the record or addl info

Just wanted to bump this thread because it is the anniversary of this "lovers lane" double murder. This case was investigated by Alameda County, and ballistics compared to ballistics from the 12/20/68 Z murders, but the samples were too damaged to get a result, and it was INCONCLUSIVE. The lead Detective in charge of cold cases in Alameda went into sort of a forced retirement, and due to budget cuts, this case was NOT re-opened. Weirdest of all, is that the Families of the two victims did not show any real interest in having the case re-opened.

Personally, I think this crime has Zodiac's prints all over it, and it happened in the same town where Z sent some of his letters from a couple years later.

One of the most interesting things was the fact that the two victims were stalked in the days and weeks leading up to the murders. They reported an unknown man following them in a car, and both were receiving prank calls at home from a heavy breather before & AFTER the murders. These calls usually came in between 10&11am weekdays. Robert Graysmith also reported prank calls from a heavy breather that would always come in around 10-11am. A really interesting case for sure.

As Birch Street is mentioned in the article...


Victim Cheryl Cathleen 'Cathy' Nolan, who was shot, was at Birch street shortly before her murder.


It is known, authorities said, that earlier in the evening Cheryl and a young man named "Mike" dropped in at the apartment of Roger D. Larson, 24, of 5830 Birth (Birch) street, in Oakland.

A man told police that at 11:55 p.m. he saw a tall heavy-set man wearing a windbreaker.

A windbreaker was also mentioned in the Kathleen Johns incident, however that was 3,5 years later.

His windbreaker was open and she could see the white of his shirt glowing dully in the moonlight.

QT

Quicktrader wrote:

As Birch Street is mentioned in the article...


Victim Cheryl Cathleen 'Cathy' Nolan, who was shot, was at Birch street shortly before her murder.


It is known, authorities said, that earlier in the evening Cheryl and a young man named "Mike" dropped in at the apartment of Roger D. Larson, 24, of 5830 Birth (Birch) street, in Oakland.

A man told police that at 11:55 p.m. he saw a tall heavy-set man wearing a windbreaker.

A windbreaker was also mentioned in the Kathleen Johns incident, however that was 3,5 years later.

His windbreaker was open and she could see the white of his shirt glowing dully in the moonlight.

QT

The Birch St address connected to the case in question in this thread was in Sunnyvalle, the one you refere to was located in Oakland.

There is a Birch AVENUE in Sunnyvalle, different housenumber anyway.

This is a good find. This Sunol double murder may be the link I am looking for to connect Pleasanton to Zodiac.
(very important) What would have been the husbands employer?

(Very important:) Are these crime scenes within the jurisdiction of Pleasantons school district? If not, are they in Sunol School district? Does Sunol have a highschool?

(very important:) Did Sunol residents travel to Pleasanton for highschool?

Were any victims of Zodiac/ or any unsolved murders of the area of the Zodiac crimes/ or any rapes within the Zodiac vicinity of crimes... connected to Pleasanton or Sunol in any way(were any victims from this area)? Any information tying any of the Zodiac crime victims to this area (Pleasanton /Sunol) I am desperately seeking. Alot of you Zodiac sleuths hold differnt parts of the key and I am really impressed with what I found here so far.
Sorry, I can not elaborate other than I am researching for an LE contact and trying to get my POI named as a suspect, or better yet, arrested for these crimes. Since He is not currently named a suspect, I can not elaborate his name yet, but I am really pushing for him to be tied to these crimes and named a suspect. I think these were crimes in his back yard and tied to his first line of employment possibly.
Does anyone have access to making photos of Pleasanton (Amador Valley High School) year book pages from 1963-1967?(if so please contact me) especially 1967 yerbook, PLEASE!
Again, this is a very good find. Congrats on the fine work with the site Morf13. Very well done .

Have you tried Classmates .com ? Zam if you are reading this , this is something we can do for him.

I would also like to know if Roger Larson was related to a Sue ?

TimeCop wrote:

This is a good find. This Sunol double murder may be the link I am looking for to connect Pleasanton to Zodiac.
(very important) What would have been the husbands employer?

(Very important:) Are these crime scenes within the jurisdiction of Pleasantons school district? If not, are they in Sunol School district? Does Sunol have a highschool?

(very important:) Did Sunol residents travel to Pleasanton for highschool?

Were any victims of Zodiac/ or any unsolved murders of the area of the Zodiac crimes/ or any rapes within the Zodiac vicinity of crimes... connected to Pleasanton or Sunol in any way(were any victims from this area)? Any information tying any of the Zodiac crime victims to this area (Pleasanton /Sunol) I am desperately seeking. Alot of you Zodiac sleuths hold differnt parts of the key and I am really impressed with what I found here so far.
Sorry, I can not elaborate other than I am researching for an LE contact and trying to get my POI named as a suspect, or better yet, arrested for these crimes. Since He is not currently named a suspect, I can not elaborate his name yet, but I am really pushing for him to be tied to these crimes and named a suspect. I think these were crimes in his back yard and tied to his first line of employment possibly.
Does anyone have access to making photos of Pleasanton (Amador Valley High School) year book pages from 1963-1967?(if so please contact me) especially 1967 yerbook, PLEASE!
Again, this is a very good find. Congrats on the fine work with the site Morf13. Very well done .

I think the male victim,if i recall, worked for a cement company(I cant remember for sure, you may have to re-read all of these articles). This case was handled by the Alameda County sheriff's dept,not sure which schools people went to. Also, there was one letter mailed by Zodiac in Pleasanton I think, and Donna Lass's sister received a Christmas card that may have been from Zodiac, also think that was postmarked in Pleasanton

I am most cinfident my POI is from Pleasanton Amador High in 1967(graduate year), I am aware a letter was mailed from there,(pleasanton) that was the coincidence that got me digging deepr a few months back. I have since possibly linked my PLEASANTON poi to one of the victims in a very odd way, enough to get LE listening to me. I have found a name several times in double codes and think he went to school in Pleasanton. Anyone who can CONFIRM my Poi, I will share his name in a Private mail. I am most confident, this is our guy. I just need to get his yearbook. Any members from that yearbook (amador 1967)with the last Initial H is appreciated, as the desktop poem is rh, but thats not the right fiirst letter. It means something else. All photos in attatchments can be sent to my private mail. I may also share my email with the right person through Morf13.
Any photos of males with last initial H is appreciated. He may stand out. This is important to get to my next step, a presentation in front of LE that confirms my POI was in that area and near SUNOL which may even open a can of worms for my POI. and the BATES case.

I have dial -up and is the reason I am asking some of you with high speeds and printers to help. I wouldn't mind snail mail coppies as well, if interested holler.

What were the cement companies in that area at the time? My poi used to work in cement long before 30 years ago and possibly as a youth while living in that area. This would possibly be a connector to Zodiac..

morf13 wrote:

TimeCop wrote:

This is a good find. This Sunol double murder may be the link I am looking for to connect Pleasanton to Zodiac.
(very important) What would have been the husbands employer?

(Very important:) Are these crime scenes within the jurisdiction of Pleasantons school district? If not, are they in Sunol School district? Does Sunol have a highschool?

(very important:) Did Sunol residents travel to Pleasanton for highschool?

Were any victims of Zodiac/ or any unsolved murders of the area of the Zodiac crimes/ or any rapes within the Zodiac vicinity of crimes... connected to Pleasanton or Sunol in any way(were any victims from this area)? Any information tying any of the Zodiac crime victims to this area (Pleasanton /Sunol) I am desperately seeking. Alot of you Zodiac sleuths hold different parts of the key and I am really impressed with what I found here so far.
Sorry, I can not elaborate other than I am researching for an LE contact and trying to get my POI named as a suspect, or better yet, arrested for these crimes. Since He is not currently named a suspect, I can not elaborate his name yet, but I am really pushing for him to be tied to these crimes and named a suspect. I think these were crimes in his back yard and tied to his first line of employment possibly.
Does anyone have access to making photos of Pleasanton (Amador Valley High School) year book pages from 1963-1967?(if so please contact me) especially 1967 yearbook, PLEASE!
Again, this is a very good find. Congrats on the fine work with the site Morf13. Very well done .

I think the male victim,if i recall, worked for a cement company(I cant remember for sure, you may have to re-read all of these articles). This case was handled by the Alameda County sheriff's dept,not sure which schools people went to. Also, there was one letter mailed by Zodiac in Pleasanton I think, and Donna Lass's sister received a Christmas card that may have been from Zodiac, also think that was postmarked in Pleasanton

http://www.thezodiacmansonconnection.com/1974_christmas_card.html

The Lass Card was Alameda County.See link for photos and write up. It was very,very difficult to get this card and envelope from Mary. Waiting and talking to her about getting copies was a real test on my nerves.
Some ignore who got it and act a if they discovered it or they give with no attribution. I have seen this all over the web. Disgusting.

The PL letter was 3/13/71 (R.Hubbards B Day-if you were into Scientology that was a well noted mo/day! FYI) postmarked Pleasanton (named after a military general) the first time. I know of no other letters mailed from PL. Sometimes Z would do a one of a kind non Z thing!

Johns told me that when she asked the stranger as he was driving about his work he said 'I work for about three months then drive a lot.'Scary. Perhaps construction. In the past I have known of some men to do this.Sometimes all over the country. If they were union members they were given work assignments.Some like this kind of life. Some truck drivers as we know drive all over the US and some are or drive within their own state.

I think my POI was a genuine Freemason( he learned some heavy math in concrete work). The reason I think it is important to find the cement companies of that area and time is because my POI may have been linked to the womans husband who was a concrete worker in or near Mountain View, California, as stated in this thread way back in the start. Maybe he had a fixation on this guys wife and caught her with another guy and killed her. Maybe this husband guy was my POI's boss or co-worker?
Another reason is this. The AMADOR symbol is the FREEMASON symbol and a concrete worker from AMADOR HIGH would know that and if he was a serial killer, he would sign his name using the compass rose,the freemason symbol,his highscool and his Full name when connected to Celtic runes or Norse meanings. Remember, he made that scope which is a cross hairs and he is deep into measurements and math. . Maybe he is in his first year of concrete at the time and was schooled with some good math scores, an A+ student,an honor student(that could not get the girls). I think he knew every victim and calculated with math, when to kill them, how and who would be the victim by NAME, thus the Zodiac goes on to connect the location, the symbol,the compass, the square and Mt. Diablo to his satanic deeds and puzzle that he made a game of to be able to deal with his (censored words) mind. mind you, the symbol is satanic as well and linked to the PHALLUS and Manson and Alister Crowley and LAvey....yes those Laveyans...). This suggests to me the Zodiac is my guy and as I mentioned in another thread(STeens Pillar a phallus shape) is a prime connector to my POI, I can prove that beyond a doubt and have him tied to that area. Linking him to these crimes would be a nail in his coffin, a confirmation of the math I am exposing and his true intention as a devil to make fools of everyone.. I need to find what concrete companies opperated in that area at the time of this crime. AN old phone book from 1967 would be a good find. If I can list the cement companies that existed, I can have a lead for LE to ask my POI where he worked in Pleasanton or that area as a late teen (18) in 1967.
Mind you, my POI is 64 and strong as an ox. He has many years left to live. It bums me that funding for this case ended for cold case in CA and that I have to work as an informant to nail my POI in his current residential town..

TimeCop wrote:

I have dial -up and is the reason I am asking some of you with high speeds and printers to help. I wouldn't mind snail mail coppies as well, if interested holler.

As I previously offered, if you PM me his full name,date of birth, etc, whatever you have, I would be glad to help you out. I am sure other would do the same.

Morf , Sometime back in the early 90's when we had a lot of unsolved murder / kidnapping here. There was a young girl whom I saw hitch hiking on A street in Antioch. Her body was dumped in Pleasanton in a ditch alongside of 580 freeway . I don't remember her name, but she was in her teens. Maybe your contact knows this case ? My poi traveled in that direction , because his car broke down on Vasco rd around that time. It was a green car which was described by many women who were being followed on that road and Marsh Creek rd . (Of course it could be some other guy with a green car.)
There were two victims who were killed by alcohol poisoning around the same time, the teen was one of them.

sandy betts wrote:

Morf , Sometime back in the early 90's when we had a lot of unsolved murder / kidnapping here. There was a young girl whom I saw hitch hiking on A street in Antioch. Her body was dumped in Pleasanton in a ditch alongside of 580 freeway . I don't remember her name, but she was in her teens. Maybe your contact knows this case ? My poi traveled in that direction , because his car broke down on Vasco rd around that time. It was a green car which was described by many women who were being followed on that road and Marsh Creek rd . (Of course it could be some other guy with a green car.)
There were two victims who were killed by alcohol poisoning around the same time, the teen was one of them.

My contact was Alameda County Sheriff's dept, and cold case supervisor, Scott Dudek, who retired last year. I dont have anybody that I am currently in touch with there now,

Some retired detectives whom I have met, have a hard time letting go of their old cases and still want to get them solved.
You might want to see if he minds keeping in touch ? One of his guys in the Alameda Sheriffs dept., was the owner of Pier 29 where I worked in Oakland. My poi stayed away for a long time when Sheriff Ron Kane bought it in the late 80's.