Troy Houghton: The Minuteman

I guess you're skeptical. No matter. I can only show you who the killer was with item after item after item; I can't force you to see the truth of this case.
I like Kevin B a great deal, and I wish him all the best. But Z wasn't Bujok for one very simple but powerful reason: Z was TH. You'll see.

What you read was Zodiac asking for people to wear Zodiac buttons, contrary to your statement "He doesn't say Zodiac buttons". Are we supposed to ignore it?

rand wrote:

I guess you're skeptical. No matter. I can only show you who the killer was with item after item after item; I can't force you to see the truth of this case.
I like Kevin B a great deal, and I wish him all the best. But Z wasn't Bujok for one very simple but powerful reason: Z was TH. You'll see.

Oh yeah!!! Just kidding! You might be right! Rand I can't think of a better person to be right! I'll tell you have made a pretty strong case. Yes, it's true I looked at Dennis Kaufman's guy for a while a few years ago and said in my posts "if this info is true this just might be our guy".... That was if...

Well I found out many things on my own Dennis was being dishonest about and it seemed he really wanted this man to be his step-dad so much so he created evidence. I didn't like when a bunch of grown people wasted their time attacking the guy.... He probably has it hard enough. I looked ALA but you could only go so far... William Joseph Grant; the same, Larry Kane; the same. But Houghton he caught my eye and I will say this: If he's not Zodiac, he sure is one interesting fella and you have made a far better case for him than any other suspect and you have been open with it!

I wish you only luck and if happens that Houghton’s the man, I thank God it’s this site that let you be free to dive deep!!! After all if we get this guy we get to start fresh on a new one!!! If this site is the one that proves it, maybe we can help elsewhere.... i just thank Zam for being so kind and morf encouraging me and Rand you being a friend and of course the Swede... I like him !

Kevin B.

Kevin B wrote:

After all if we get this guy we get to start fresh on a new one!!!

Oh cripes I hope not!

bentley wrote:

What you read was Zodiac asking for people to wear Zodiac buttons, contrary to your statement "He doesn't say Zodiac buttons". Are we supposed to ignore it?

nope. but it seems that most everyone here ignores everything I post except things that they disagree with.

The bottom line for me is that there are 50 or more very specific items that line up perfectly with TH. When I spoke to his best friend, he only gave me more ammunition. 20 or so additional things that smack of Z.
The dates of the murders, which we know had significance for Z because of Hartnell's door, line up perfectly as well.

All four dates of the murders are extremely meaningful to TH. His wife's birthday, his birthday, his first son's birthday, and July 4th (if that date doesn't say Minutemen, what date would?).

TH made it perfectly clear who he was with all the clues and the dates of the murders. Show me someone else (anyone else) for whom all four murder dates are extremely significant, and by extremely significant I mean dates that correspond precisely with his identity and/or those of his wife and kids. I don't think it's statistically possible for ALL the dates to match without the person being Z. But, for the record, that's only one item out of dozens that tell me it's TH.

Look, for example, at the skeleton's hands: They point to: TH ME



On a card where he says he'll clue us in about his identity, the hands of the skeleton that he placed on the card point to TH and ME. Not TK and ME, not ALA and ME, but TH and ME.
And on the back of the card there's a figure composed of a t and H.

Look at the strange symbol. It mimicks the hands of the "Flashing" skeleton and is composed of an F and L (for Flasher) with four dots - the 4-TEENs that TH was convicted of flashing.

Then Zodiac draws a Z and a crosshair. Why would he be so obviously redundant here? Why would he have drawn, where his signature would go, two symbols to represent his Zodiac identity? He didn't. The crosshair is for MM, the Z is for Zodiac, the strange symbol is for Flasher. His three identities where his signature would be on the card. He says that the card will clue us in about his identity. And it surely does.

rand wrote:

bentley wrote:

What you read was Zodiac asking for people to wear Zodiac buttons, contrary to your statement "He doesn't say Zodiac buttons". Are we supposed to ignore it?

nope. but it seems that most everyone here ignores everything I post except things that they disagree with.

That's our job...

I was intrigued by the MM sign matching Z's. That's why I checked the other letters.

Kevin started with a much more palpable suspect, a direct Deer Lodge/Slaves reference, that's probably why people tend to gravitate more that way. It could all be a load of crap by Ed Edwards, and your guy could be Z, but it's a harder push for you. Don't sweat it, keep digging, nobody's got him yet.

That darn HC card is open to so many interpretations, but it doesn't hurt to consider the possibilities!

If TH is the guy, it would make sense. But, just looking at what you provided above rand doesn't cut-it for me. The hand could just as easily be pointing to "en".

Heck, I'm still not confident this was from Zodiac! But, you are making a case so that is good.

Thanks, Bentley. I do have good Deer Lodge and slaves for the afterlife connections, though perhaps not as "direct" as for Kevin B's POI. The FBI claimed there was a MM (or two) up in the hills of MT during the convict escape in the summer of 1968. And the "slaves for the afterlife" strikes me as a reference that TH was allegedly murdered and so was in his "after-life" while he was killing. Hence, slaves for the afterlife. Anyhow, I'll keep digging.

tahoe27 wrote:

That darn HC card is open to so many interpretations, but it doesn't hurt to consider the possibilities!

If TH is the guy, it would make sense. But, just looking at what you provided above rand doesn't cut-it for me. The hand could just as easily be pointing to "en".

Heck, I'm still not confident this was from Zodiac! But, you are making a case so that is good.

But if you look closely you'll notice that the index finger is pointing to TH; while the rest of the fingers are merely over the en.



There's alot more on the card of course. The image of a flasher for one thing. Then there's what brought me to the MM: Rembrandt's observation that the MM decal contained a crosshair symbol and a paragraph about murdering people BY GUN, BY ROPE, BY KNIFE, BY POISON PEN





Z's POISON PEN:



The there's the LAV twice on the card. AK showed it can be read as VAL-ER-LY for VALERIE. Combine this with the BOO and OIL on the inside: VALERIE BOYLE - TH's domineering mother.

Then there are the eyes for LOOK magazine; and they form the word TROY: BY TROY



Then there's the 4-TEEN and the strange symbol, which I've explained as the reference to TH flashing 4 teens.
So that's a heck of alot of clues for one measly card.

The big and important point I'm trying to make with the post above in response to Tahoe is that you have to consider the TOTALITY of the things that point to TH on the card -- which is not just any card but one that Z said would clue us in to his identity. Of course, I can't prove any individual clue is what I claim it is. So if we single out a clue and say: well it could be something else entirely. Sure, it could be. But every detail that Z painstakingly put on the clue can be read (without torturing the meaning) as pertaining directly to TH's identity. So, with that in mind, consider these details on the card.

1. Do the hands point to TH and ME? I think so, but maybe not. One could say that they point to EN and ME.
2. Is it the image of a flasher? Seems clear to me, but it's merely an interpretation.
3. Does the strange symbol represent FL for FLASHER and are the dots the 4-TEENs that TH flashed? I think so, but maybe not. It's worth pointing out that there are 4 dots, not 5, 3, 2, 6, 7 etc. If there had not been 4 dots and only 4 dots, then I could not say that the symbol represents the 4-TEENs that TH was convicted of flashing.
4. Does it say VALERIE BOYLE? Seems like it to me, but maybe not. All I can say is that one can get VALERIE BOYLE from the card. (Does anyone see any other POI's mother on the card?)
5. Is the BY GUN, BY KNIFE, etc. figure on the back of the card a representation of t and H for Troy Houghton? I think so, but maybe not.
6. Are the eyes meant to be a clue for TH's LOOK magazine feature? I think so, but maybe not.
7. Do the eyes form the word TROY? I have shown that they can, but maybe it's a coincidence. It's worth pointing out that they clearly don't form LEE or DONALD or TED or THEODORE.
8. Is the BY GUN, BY KNIFE, BY ROPE, BY FIRE a reference to the MM decal put on Bay Area cars in 1968? I can't say for sure, but it fits AND it's the only place that I can find a crosshair and references to murder by knife, rope, gun, and poison pen.

So I admit that we can haggle over any individual item on the card and disagree. But when you look at all the items together, every one of them can be linked very directly to TH. In other words, TH's identity (what we know about him) sheds light on the information/clues that Z put on the card. Without TH, you don't see VALERIE BOYLE, you don't see the strange symbol as a FLasher with 4-TEENs as the victims, you don't see the figure as composed of a tH, you don't see the hands pointing to th me, and you don't even see the flasher image (which no one suggested until I found TH as a POI).

Here are notes from Troy Houghton:

"First of all there are types of explosives.

1. Black power--explodes fuse or match spark--flame.
2. Dynamite 40-50-60-70% strength & lesser strength
3. T.N.T.
4. Nitro starch
5. composition B & C & C3 & C4
6. prima cord
7. Mercury Fulmanit
8. Fuse & electrical type detonating caps.
"280 Grains DuPont Powder for filling grenade
"buy for Flintock guns
"Bullseye is a good powder.
"Black powder is best. put in 2" pipe -- drill hole insert fuse light
fuse & throw & run."

Compare with:




MINUTEMEN and CHERI JO BATES ON THE COVER PAGE: HERE'S THE CONNECTION



TROY WAS IN LOS ANGELES THAT AFTERNOON. THEN THE MM BUST. THEN CJB IS MURDERED IN RIVERSIDE. TROY IS DRIVING HOME, ANGRY, AND DECIDES HE'S IN A VERY BAD MOOD THAT NIGHT

Dear Rand,
I honestly honestly hate to edit or delete posts. But being a Mod here, there are rules. And if a rule applies to one person then it must apply to all. The rule is no badmouthing others, or bringing in any wars between posters and the forums. So...please everyone follow the rules. I totally understand emotions sometimes when things happen. But we can't fix everything. I suggest if you or anyone has an issue with another poster or forum to please talk it out with them via PM or Email. Appreciate everyone's help in this matter. Much Thanks!

Zincerely, Zam*

rand wrote:

Dear Rand,
I honestly honestly hate to edit or delete posts. But being a Mod here, there are rules. And if a rule applies to one person then it must apply to all. The rule is no badmouthing others, or bringing in any wars between posters and the forums. So...please everyone follow the rules. I totally understand emotions sometimes when things happen. But we can't fix everything. I suggest if you or anyone has an issue with another poster or forum to please talk it out with them via PM or Email. Appreciate everyone's help in this matter. Much Thanks!

Zincerely, Zam*

I had to edit and delete Rands post. Reason: against forum rules.

Zam: I didn't badmouth collinsmix. I asked him to debate me on the facts. He called me delusional on zk.com, a place where I can't comment. So I said: if I'm delusional, go ahead and tell me what I've said that is delusional. Let's debate every point I've made and see. Where did I call him delusional? I'm confused. But fine, delete the post. Who cares anyway. If someone wants to call me names on another site, if someone thinks I'm delusional, fine. Time will tell.

AK Wilks wrote:

Per board rules there will be NO negative attacks on Kevin no personal attacks on Tom V and no discussion of what happened at other boards here. Period. Anyone who violates the rules will have the post removed and if it happens again will be banned. Lets all move on. This thread is about Bujok.

Just to help rand, no discussion of what happened at other boards. Just what I was told.

rand wrote:

Zam: I didn't badmouth collinsmix. I asked him to debate me on the facts. He called me delusional on zk.com, a place where I can't comment. So I said: if I'm delusional, go ahead and tell me what I've said that is delusional. Let's debate every point I've made and see. Where did I call him delusional? I'm confused. But fine, delete the post. Who cares anyway. If someone wants to call me names on another site, if someone thinks I'm delusional, fine. Time will tell.

Rand, I didn't ever bring up the word delusional in my post?
If you would like to invite Collinsmix over here for a debate..that is fine.
Ask someone to send him a message and invite him. Or it sounds like he
is already here under another posting name to be able to read your posts.
Then the two of you can debate it out. I have seen that work in the past. This
way you are able to discuss your issues w/o any name calling on either part and
with out bringing in the forum or poster wars.
Thankz,

Bottom line, please do not use this forum to respond to posts at other forums.

This is not rocket surgery."

Now here's a debate that we can actually resolve. What date did Z mean to suggest for BRS?

He tells us on Hartnell's door: JULY 4th.



There are larger points here.
First, don't miss the forest for the trees. Yes, Z technically murdered on July 5th. But to suggest that this means July 4th COULDN'T POSSIBLY have anything to do with the reason he murdered at the time he did is to miss the forest for the trees.

Second, Z was a bumbler. He meant to kill on July 4, and could easily have done so, but he didn't. He messed it up. Just like the murders themselves. He most probably meant to murder Mageau and Ferrin; Hartnell and Shepard. But he failed to do so, though they were defenseless in defenseless positions..
He almost got caught after Stine as well.
Z was no mastermind, perfect criminal. He was a bumbler that got lucky. That's TH to a tee.

We mustn't forget that the time of death recorded was approximately 12.10am - could have been 12am, 12.05am, etc.

I think Z wanted to kill that night - July 4th - and possibly at midnight. I just don't think the opportunity arose until that particular moment, or he was having last minute nerves (hence possibly arriving, leaving then returning again). Maybe there were a lot of people out that night celebrating and Z wanted to wait until the roads were a little quieter?

precisely.

Pulling in comments from private emails from Tom isn't necessary rand, and I think that isn't right to share with others. You can make your point without bringing his personal comments to the table.

Not sure why you felt the need to write Tom in the first place? I think you have been down that road...

Rand,
I made another edit to one of your posts. We have no problems with you posting your research and ideas.
But here's another reminder: No forum wars allowed on this forum. It's not worth the energy for any of us to
have to read. We have posters on this forum from all the forums, that just don't want to read that stuff.

So please, I ask you one more time.....you know the rules.
And remember I really dislike being the enforcer. So please don't make me keep having to so this. I would
appreciate it. Thanks.

Zam*

morf13 wrote:

Bottom line, please do not use this forum to respond to posts at other forums.

Bottom Line being reinforced.

Yes, Rand, please try not to stir up anything. If for some reason you feel Tom has something important, and he give you permission to share it, thats one thing. But if there is any jabbing back and forth between you and him, please keep it off of the forum. Again, we do NOT want to bash any other forums or people there. If you have issues with other forums, or people, please hash it out privately, or over on that forum.

tahoe27 wrote:

Pulling in comments from private emails from Tom isn't necessary rand, and I think that isn't right to share with others. You can make your point without bringing his personal comments to the table.

Not sure why you felt the need to write Tom in the first place? I think you have been down that road...

I didn't say anything derogatory about Tom, so I don't see what the problem would be. I used it simply because I think it's instructional and makes a larger point: Tom raised an issue that I'm sure others would raise or were thinking. I then went on to address the issue. It's not a scuffle between me and Tom, there's no name-calling, and it's not a post from another forum. It was a back and forth that I think is necessary for this thread. But if that's also a "no-no," okay. You learn something new everyday, I suppose.

Here's the point of the exchange: Tom was pointing out that BRS was actually on July 5th. He believes that this is proof that Z had no intention of signaling July 4th as an important date. If July 4 was important to Z, then Z would have been sure to murder on that date and not 15 minutes later.

My point is that Z did mean to signal July 4 as an important date. We must figure out what Z intended, not what he actually did. Z intended to kill both Mageau and Ferrin, same at LB. But if we look at "the facts" and let them speak for themselves, we miss the bigger picture and, more imporant, "the meaning" of what he did.
We also miss the fact that Z meant things but was too clumsy to pull them off. He was not a precise killer; he was a lucky bumbler. Those are very important points in my opinion.

This is not at all a spat between Tom and me. That was not the point of the post and there was nothing vitriolic about our exchange. But it's an important exchange because it gets to the heart of the matter: how do we interpret what we know about Z and his crimes. The details, which Tom felt I was conveniently overlooking merely to support my theory, about the facts of the case often mislead more than enlighten when they are not filtered through judicious interpretation. The facts rarely speak for themselves.

The fact is that BRS occurred on July 5th, and I have been saying July 4th. My mistake and one worth pointing out. But I think July 4th is actually a more accurate date for BRS than July 5th, odd as that may seem. July 4 is the date that Z intended and we know that because he wrote it on Hartnell's door.

Consider this too (and this is very counterintuitive): doesn't the wrong date on Hartnell's door show (prove) that LB was a Z crime? If it was a fake, why would he put the wrong date on the door? Only Z knew what he intended with BRS. A fake wouldn't alter the "facts" of the incident, right?