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 Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo

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morf13
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Oct 13, 2011 6:43 am

Although the military records division could find no record of this guy, a Family member of this POI told me that he was drafted and was in Vietnam, I think in the Army. Trying to get more details. This same Family member told me that this POI lived in Vallejo area from 69-74. Wondering if it is possible that this POI was at the Presidio?
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:18 pm

Great information Morf and yep curious about Presidio as well.
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:57 am

Found this at: http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/notorious/zodiac_profile/5.html

A former FBI profile profiled Zodiac, and mentioned... "we find several symbols in his initial cryptogram that look like the symbol for Taurus the bull, which could identify his approximate birth date"

I know that there were Taurus looking symbols in the 'MY NAME IS' cipher (circled 8's). People with the sign of Taurus were born April 20-May 20. This suspect is a Taurus.

Still trying to dig for more stuff, but not getting far. I think this guy has sort have lived off of the grid,or at least stayed clear of the public eye.
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:48 am

Thanks for the recent offers to help research this guy, he certainly merits further investigation. Anybody that graduated HS with Cheri Jo Bates then wound up in Vallejo circa the Z murders is a strong candidate in my book. If only this guy hadnt kept such a low profile, finding stuff on him would be easier.

Some people think that a 21 year old zodiac is a stretch,maybe too young, but Hartnell said that Z may have been in his 20's,and Officer Slaight who talked to Z after Lake Berryessa described Z's voice as being in his early 20's:

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Jan 05, 2012 8:51 am

Tracers posted this over on ZK.com, and it is an interesting article



If the police and writing experts were right, then we need to look at people in Riverside 66-67. And as the article states, why not mention Bates in his letters as one of his victims? Somebody like this suspect that knew her might be afraid he would be a suspect. Remember, its not whether Z killed Bates or not(I personally think he may have), but its a question of the letters in her case. If the authorities are right, then Z had to have been in Riverside circa 66-67, and then later in Vallejo during the Z murders. So far, this is the ONLY person that can be proven to fit that criteria, and just so happens he knew Bates and graduated with her.

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:22 pm

morf13 wrote:
Tracers posted this over on ZK.com, and it is an interesting article



If the police and writing experts were right, then we need to look at people in Riverside 66-67. And as the article states, why not mention Bates in his letters as one of his victims? Somebody like this suspect that knew her might be afraid he would be a suspect. Remember, its not whether Z killed Bates or not(I personally think he may have), but its a question of the letters in her case. If the authorities are right, then Z had to have been in Riverside circa 66-67, and then later in Vallejo during the Z murders. So far, this is the ONLY person that can be proven to fit that criteria, and just so happens he knew Bates and graduated with her.
Thanks to Tracers great little article and makes sense. I agree Morf and something I never mentioned is the irony of this guys name, I could see if he was Z getting a kick out of it while he taunts police.
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Jan 05, 2012 7:43 pm

If that were the case, it would seem he knew Cecelia then. Or just a lucky coincidence?

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:05 pm

tahoe27 wrote:
If that were the case, it would seem he knew Cecelia then. Or just a lucky coincidence?

I have no idea if he knew her, and it would be wild speculation on my part, but he certainly had his ties to Riverside & to Vallejo. On the other hand, I am quite certain he knew Cheri Jo Bates, and would love to know if any of her friends or her boyfriend knew him or associated with him

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:05 pm

morf13 wrote:
Somebody pointed out to me that the symbols used on the "my name is" cipher make up much of this guy's name:

Being so short, it's impossible to verify the solution 100% however, what is the probability of this being a simple substitution cipher for a specific name?
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sat Jan 07, 2012 7:47 pm

Luke68 wrote:
morf13 wrote:
Somebody pointed out to me that the symbols used on the "my name is" cipher make up much of this guy's name:

Being so short, it's impossible to verify the solution 100% however, what is the probability of this being a simple substitution cipher for a specific name?
Yep pretty ironic if you know this guys name isn't it ?
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:42 pm

StitchMallone wrote:
Luke68 wrote:
morf13 wrote:
Somebody pointed out to me that the symbols used on the "my name is" cipher make up much of this guy's name:

Being so short, it's impossible to verify the solution 100% however, what is the probability of this being a simple substitution cipher for a specific name?
Yep pretty ironic if you know this guys name isn't it ?

The first symbol A is also the first letter of his first name. The last 3 symbols NAM, are also the last 3 letters of his last name, just re-arranged. Using his first name, middle initial,and last name, there is the same amount of spaces as in the cipher, and the same amount of different letters matches the same amount of different symbols in the cipher. He has 3 total E's in his first & lastname,and there are 3 Taurus symbols in the cipher(circled 8's), and yes, he IS a Taurus!

And compare it to the Bates Confession letter:
Also, in the confession letter...the person that typed iit typed "THE CONFESSION BY _________________"
Judging by the space on the line, compared to the typed letters just under it, I would say there is about 16-18 spaces there.


His full name typed out without spaces is 16 letters, with a space after his first name and middle name, then we would have 18 spaces. It fits perfectly

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:51 pm

Yep, there are exactly the same number of different variables as there are different letters in his name. Can anyone work out how statistically significant this is? Nin?
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:59 pm

Luke68 wrote:
Yep, there are exactly the same number of different variables as there are different letters in his name. Can anyone work out how statistically significant this is? Nin?

I think NIN is good at that stuff.

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PostSubject: This is kind of funny   Sat Jan 07, 2012 10:38 pm

I think it's clear that the circled 8 is the Taurus Symbol. Given that in '69 one of the most asked questions you would ask someone when you met them was, "What's your sign". But I found this amusing...

I googled what the vertical number 8 means, it means, "A person who wears glasses"..

A horizontal 8 means a person who wears "Sunglasses"....
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 2:39 pm

While this guy is certainly a good suspect in my opinion,I have nothing new on him. I did however find one more potential POI that was a fellow graduate of Cheri's that has a VERY UNUSUAL last name, and DEFINITELY lived in the Alameda county area(where most of the Z letters were postmarked from). He does not have glasses in the few photos I have seen of him, but he does have a large face as some have described z as having,and dark hair. He has lived in Castro Valley,San leandro,Livermore, Artesia,Cypress & Hayward. I am going to try and nail down some exact years when he lived at these addresses. This guy was a pilot instructor by the way in Alameda county...there has been lots of speculation that Z was a pilot of some sort. Coincidentally,one day after the 11 year anniversary of the Bates murder, this guy crashed a plane onto a golf course. If this guy merits further research,I will spinoff a thread of his own in suspects section.I have looked at at least 20-30 white male students that attended Ramona HS with Bates, and this is only the 2nd one I can place in the Vallejo area around the time of the z murders. Middle name is LEE for what its worth.

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PostSubject: Morf....   Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:17 pm

Great work there.
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 5:08 pm

morf13 wrote:
DEFINITELY lived in the Alameda county area(where most of the Z letters were postmarked from).

Only one letter I know of was postmarked Alameda, most were San Fran.. Alameda is on the other side of the bay. Was a military base though..
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PostSubject: Z Letters   Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:11 pm

An.
d I think one was postmarked Pleasanton. But in those days there was nothing out there in Pleasanton
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:00 pm

Sorry, is SF in Alameda County or is it SF county? Mind fart for a sec

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PostSubject: MORF   Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:10 pm

SF is in SF County....
Oakland is in Alameda County
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:05 pm

morf13 wrote:
While this guy is certainly a good suspect in my opinion,I have nothing new on him. I did however find one more potential POI that was a fellow graduate of Cheri's that has a VERY UNUSUAL last name, and DEFINITELY lived in the Alameda county area(where most of the Z letters were postmarked from). He does not have glasses in the few photos I have seen of him, but he does have a large face as some have described z as having,and dark hair. He has lived in Castro Valley,San leandro,Livermore, Artesia,Cypress & Hayward. I am going to try and nail down some exact years when he lived at these addresses. This guy was a pilot instructor by the way in Alameda county...there has been lots of speculation that Z was a pilot of some sort. Coincidentally,one day after the 11 year anniversary of the Bates murder, this guy crashed a plane onto a golf course. If this guy merits further research,I will spinoff a thread of his own in suspects section.I have looked at at least 20-30 white male students that attended Ramona HS with Bates, and this is only the 2nd one I can place in the Vallejo area around the time of the z murders. Middle name is LEE for what its worth.

I found a picture of him, a recent picture though, with glasses.
I have PM'ed you my research findings.
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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:55 pm

Thanks Foreigner, I appreciate the help and although there only seem to be a few of Cheri's classmates in the SF bay area during the Z murder spree, I hope they can be ruled out one at a time.

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:58 pm

Luke68 wrote:
Yep, there are exactly the same number of different variables as there are different letters in his name. Can anyone work out how statistically significant this is? Nin?

Sorry for the late reply. It is not significant at all. Whether the number of variables is identical with the unique letters in the individual's name or whether the letters were actually identical with the letters in the individual's name is insignificant.

Also, your thoughts are based on the assumption that the writer really revealed his name in the cipher. The "My name is ..." and then the cipher with "NAM" in the end is similar to a worm dangling from a hook. If I said he did not reveal his name in the cipher I would assume the same you are doing, just in reverse. So all I say is, we can not assume that he did give his name as well as we cannot assume that he did not give his name. However, Zodiac likes the game, so I am tempted to lean towards he did not reveal his name, just because he said he did. If he did give us his name in this ultra short "cipher" we will never know: That is what he did know for sure.

-Nin

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:12 pm

Nin wrote:
Luke68 wrote:
Yep, there are exactly the same number of different variables as there are different letters in his name. Can anyone work out how statistically significant this is? Nin?

Sorry for the late reply. It is not significant at all. Whether the number of variables is identical with the unique letters in the individual's name or whether the letters were actually identical with the letters in the individual's name is insignificant.

Also, your thoughts are based on the assumption that the writer really revealed his name in the cipher. The "My name is ..." and then the cipher with "NAM" in the end is similar to a worm dangling from a hook. If I said he did not reveal his name in the cipher I would assume the same you are doing, just in reverse. So all I say is, we can not assume that he did give his name as well as we cannot assume that he did not give his name. However, Zodiac likes the game, so I am tempted to lean towards he did not reveal his name, just because he said he did. If he did give us his name in this ultra short "cipher" we will never know: That is what he did know for sure.

-Nin


Sounds like NIN knows what she is talking about, but I can tell you that his name fits better than any I have seen, even going as far as the first letter of his first name lining up with the first symbol(A symbol = the letter A)and the last 3 symbols lining up with the last 3 of his last name(in anagram)

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PostSubject: Re: Classmate of Cheri Jo Bates that wound up living in Vallejo   Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:13 pm

Interesting he changed his hair parting from left to right. Not that it matters, just an observation. Also, David Faraday was a member of the Vallejo High School wrestling team. Could be a connection. Maybe.

-Nin
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