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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:15 am

morf13 wrote:
Kevin, I spoke to Don's cousin, the guy that worked for the newspaper in MT. In an email to me, he wrote:

"As you know, Don Bujok is deceased. I knew him after he was released from prison. He was quiet, unassuming, articulate, well read, interested in current events, extremely poor, and not at all physically healthy. Most of the time he rode a pedal bike, but sometimes drove an old beat up Chevy pickup ('50's vintage). I visited with him from time to time when he brought "Letters to the Editor" into the local newspaper and occasionally here or there on the streets. I have no photos or writings of his in his hand. While it certainly isn't impossible that Don was the Zodiac killer, I can't hardly believe that he was in any position to periodically scoot off to California, commit murders, and blast back to Roundup and return to his life in abject poverty."

While I still think that Bujok matches up with alot of Z clues, and the letters to the editor he wrote are interesting as well as the whole 'slaves in the afterlife' references,and the mention of 'deer lodge' by Zodiac, I still think there could also be the possibility that Zodiac may have known Bujok or his phrases, and possibly been in prison with him. Don's cousin has the same concerns as most of us do, how likely was it that Bujok, broke and fresh out of prison, would travel 1000 miles back n forth to Vallejo? Its not highly likely. Remember, whomever Zodiac was, he wrote lots of letters to newspapers in the bay areas, and these letters wer concentrated on weekdays, and postmarked in the SF area....which to me inidicates that Z, was a SF bay area resident.

What I am glad to see here, is that you have Bujok's prints, and writing samples. The prints alone should be very easy to rule Bujok in or out. I hope you are right, and this case is solved, but even though everything about Bujok is interesting, he has to be ruled in or out properly by the authorities before he can be confirmed as the Zodiac or not.

Even if he turns out NOT to be Zodiac, I do have some ideas. As I said, its possible that Zodiac went to prison with Bujok. So if you can get a list of all prisoners at Deer Lodge (which I understand could be a huge number), you could do a check to see if any of them later lived in the Vallejo/Napa area. The first ones I would start with would be Edwards & Valentine. Edwards because he wrote about Bujok and his phrase 'slaves in the afterlife' (If Edwards was Z, he could have used Bujok's phrases in his letters). If Valentine was Z, he was out not too long before the Berryessa murders, and he could have used the 'Deer Lodge' reference (and maybe the 12/20/68 murders were not actually done by Z, which I personally dont believe).
Either way, the 'Deer Lodge' reference by Z could be very important.


Kevin, Keep digging until you can rule Bujok out or until they tell you he was the Zodiac






Thanks Morf! I have spoken to him as well. 'Kim' is a 2nd cousin and really didn't see Don much until he was older. Don aged very very rapidly! You will be shocked when you see the pictures the family has provided me. I know about the 57' Chevy pickup as well as the brown 61' Buick Skylark too. Believe me when I tell you I have spoken to everybody! I have the Edward's book the Deer Lodger Jerry's Riot book and have had for a while. Edwards I have had since 71'. My mom used to keep it on her nightstand after seeing Truth or Consequences. I also have pictures of my Grandfather with criminals he arrested. I will post these in the near future. Morf, they all say..... He was such a nice neighbor. Again, Kim was a 2nd cousin and really did not associate with Don as did anyone except one person that I know of..... Maybe I'm ahead of myself but I don't think so..... I learned far more of what Bujok was up to when he was 32 to 35 and it was some weird crap! Thanks Morf keep hunting!
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:24 am

Kevin B wrote:
I learned far more of what Bujok was up to when he was 32 to 35 and it was some weird crap!

Sounds intriguing Kevin - anything you can share?
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:09 pm

Kevin B wrote:
Quagmire wrote:
Good points Kevin. I remember when I read Bujok's obituary that they mentioned his disease which had steadily disabled him over the years. I read at the time that it was hereditary and could cause ssues such as club foot, etc.

Made me think that if he was locked up for his prime years and got released only to find that he would have years of suffering a degenerative illness ahead of him, then he would be pretty pee'd off with LE and no doubt would be jealous of couples in their teens making out and enjoying their best years, whilst he had been incarcerated for his.

Azazel quote: Cool By the way, since Bujok mentioned it in one of his letters something about castration,(I have some memory of that or something along those lines.) I have to ask because since 1966 California and Florida and at least seven other states, including Georgia, Iowa, Louisiana, Montana, Oregon, Texas and Wisconsin, have experimented with chemical castration. What experimented means I dont know. But experimented could ment that they tried it on different kind of offenders. Such as violent prisoners with a twist of madness... Perhaps one that murdered a sheriff?

I still can't ignore the geographical issues though. Why on earth the Bay area, and was Zodiac instead just someone living near SF who maybe just served time with Bujok and got some inspiration from him? confused



Quagmire, you are a smart one! First I agree with the disease thing and there is still plenty of work to be done on this guy however many things that could have nailed him are long gone or are they?

Ted Bundy.... He traveled thousands of miles to kill. Bujok was a loner; he worked as a traveling salesman, a ranch hand, did odd jobs, worked on cars, and stayed in mission districts when he was in Cali. In Montana he wouldn't be missed if he were gone a few days! Hop a train, take a bus or drive his 57 ‘Chevy Pickup or his 61' Buick Skylark. I believe you have to look at what is consistent in a case. If you don't, you have nothing! That's what Detective Robert Slavin told me. Bujok lost considerable weight and gained weight as well. That may have been his disguise he spoke of? If you look at my past posts I tried to explain to people what a widow’s peak was but no one paid attention. Donald Fouke's description was that of a receded hairline not a widow’s peak although he called it that. A widow’s peak is a tuft of hair in the center of the hairline that forms a small point. Troy Houghton had both! However his widow’s peak thinned as he grew older and his temples receded as well. A receded hairline is a recession at the temples that forms kind of a peninsula of hair like Zodiac has in the revised wanted poster. I liked Houghton for awhile.

Bujok tended to put weight on in the face and lose it there as well. His face could be oval when thin and more round when he was heavy. I used to think Katherine Johns might have been picked up by someone other than Zodiac, but the truth is, it could have been Bujok as he did gain and lose, gain and lose his weight. He also could be very neat at times when he was doing his sales bit... The man was 2 people! He played 'Dudley Do right' in Montana and let out his payback on the police and collected slaves in California as Zodiac.

Why would it be hard to think that a man who was a known killer and told people "all I kill we be slaves in the afterlife" not travel across a few state lines in order to not be detected and go back to prison again? That's the reason he was never caught! No one was looking in Montana except my Grandfather and people here on the board! (Azazel-I agree. If the Zodiac lived in Montana, and they looked in California ofcourse they couldn´t find him.) They were too busy trying to make a name for themselves in California! The hooded man told us who he was by what he told Hartnell! (Azazel: I dont think he intended Hartnell to survive.) No one checked until I got lucky enough to have my contact search for updated mug-shots of him. It was him! The light hair and military cut combed up in a little pompadour up front; just like Mageau described. The 1st description of Zodiac was Mike's (in my opinion) only credible one. He went off the deep end after that! Zodiac went from being 5'8" stocky with a short military cut to over 6'00" tall with jet black hair and glasses. Then he fingered bald Arthur Leigh Allen! As a known killer of a Deputy Sheriff, Zodiac told us why he killed! He was nuts! Look at the mug his 66' mug he has again gained weight and looks dead on to the wanted poster. Azazel: Could have been the blueprint for the sketch. As I see it at least.

He screwed up that night in San Francisco. I believe the prints are his! I believe he didn't plan to shoot Stine but Stine may have said something that angered him. The reason he wrote a few days later "I only look like the wanted poster when I do my thing" was bullshit! He knew he was seen after he saw that wanted poster! It looks just like him! (Azazel: I also believe that.) Also the "if you wonder why I was wiping down the prints, it was because I was leaving fake clues!” Bullshit! He knew he had been seen and was scared and that is why he wrote “I shall no longer announce when I do my murders they shall look like accidents and robberies and such”..... Bullshit... We got ya! He should have been caught a long time ago! That’s what my Grandfather said! I think this case is far more simple than we have made it and I think Don Bujok is Zodiac. that's right Kevin Brooks thinks Donald Lee Bujok is Zodiac! I could be wrong as it could be TK! I hope the prints are a match and I hope the partial DNA will help and perhaps there is more buried somewhere?

I was lazy enough to only make the points along Kevins excellent post. Thanks Kevin. And as you last said. You could be wrong. And I could be wrong. But my bet is on this one. But I leave the window open for partners in crime. The Zodiacs excorcist letter combined with Badlands and Bujoks Excorcist letter combined with his cartoonviolence letter is too much coincidence. But ofcourse Edwards or Dryman could have sent those letters. Wasnt Edwards first murder sentence in Billings?
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:35 pm

Azazel wrote:
Kevin B wrote:
Quagmire wrote:
Good points Kevin. I remember when I read Bujok's obituary that they mentioned his disease which had steadily disabled him over the years. I read at the time that it was hereditary and could cause ssues such as club foot, etc.

Made me think that if he was locked up for his prime years and got released only to find that he would have years of suffering a degenerative illness ahead of him, then he would be pretty pee'd off with LE and no doubt would be jealous of couples in their teens making out and enjoying their best years, whilst he had been incarcerated for his.

Azazel quote: Cool By the way, since Bujok mentioned it in one of his letters something about castration,(I have some memory of that or something along those lines.) I have to ask because since 1966 California and Florida and at least seven other states, including Georgia, Iowa, Louisiana, Montana, Oregon, Texas and Wisconsin, have experimented with chemical castration. What experimented means I dont know. But experimented could ment that they tried it on different kind of offenders. Such as violent prisoners with a twist of madness... Perhaps one that murdered a sheriff?

I still can't ignore the geographical issues though. Why on earth the Bay area, and was Zodiac instead just someone living near SF who maybe just served time with Bujok and got some inspiration from him? confused



Quagmire, you are a smart one! First I agree with the disease thing and there is still plenty of work to be done on this guy however many things that could have nailed him are long gone or are they?

Ted Bundy.... He traveled thousands of miles to kill. Bujok was a loner; he worked as a traveling salesman, a ranch hand, did odd jobs, worked on cars, and stayed in mission districts when he was in Cali. In Montana he wouldn't be missed if he were gone a few days! Hop a train, take a bus or drive his 57 ‘Chevy Pickup or his 61' Buick Skylark. I believe you have to look at what is consistent in a case. If you don't, you have nothing! That's what Detective Robert Slavin told me. Bujok lost considerable weight and gained weight as well. That may have been his disguise he spoke of? If you look at my past posts I tried to explain to people what a widow’s peak was but no one paid attention. Donald Fouke's description was that of a receded hairline not a widow’s peak although he called it that. A widow’s peak is a tuft of hair in the center of the hairline that forms a small point. Troy Houghton had both! However his widow’s peak thinned as he grew older and his temples receded as well. A receded hairline is a recession at the temples that forms kind of a peninsula of hair like Zodiac has in the revised wanted poster. I liked Houghton for awhile.

Bujok tended to put weight on in the face and lose it there as well. His face could be oval when thin and more round when he was heavy. I used to think Katherine Johns might have been picked up by someone other than Zodiac, but the truth is, it could have been Bujok as he did gain and lose, gain and lose his weight. He also could be very neat at times when he was doing his sales bit... The man was 2 people! He played 'Dudley Do right' in Montana and let out his payback on the police and collected slaves in California as Zodiac.

Why would it be hard to think that a man who was a known killer and told people "all I kill we be slaves in the afterlife" not travel across a few state lines in order to not be detected and go back to prison again? That's the reason he was never caught! No one was looking in Montana except my Grandfather and people here on the board! (Azazel-I agree. If the Zodiac lived in Montana, and they looked in California ofcourse they couldn´t find him.) They were too busy trying to make a name for themselves in California! The hooded man told us who he was by what he told Hartnell! (Azazel: I dont think he intended Hartnell to survive.) No one checked until I got lucky enough to have my contact search for updated mug-shots of him. It was him! The light hair and military cut combed up in a little pompadour up front; just like Mageau described. The 1st description of Zodiac was Mike's (in my opinion) only credible one. He went off the deep end after that! Zodiac went from being 5'8" stocky with a short military cut to over 6'00" tall with jet black hair and glasses. Then he fingered bald Arthur Leigh Allen! As a known killer of a Deputy Sheriff, Zodiac told us why he killed! He was nuts! Look at the mug his 66' mug he has again gained weight and looks dead on to the wanted poster. Azazel: Could have been the blueprint for the sketch. As I see it at least.

He screwed up that night in San Francisco. I believe the prints are his! I believe he didn't plan to shoot Stine but Stine may have said something that angered him. The reason he wrote a few days later "I only look like the wanted poster when I do my thing" was bullshit! He knew he was seen after he saw that wanted poster! It looks just like him! (Azazel: I also believe that.) Also the "if you wonder why I was wiping down the prints, it was because I was leaving fake clues!” Bullshit! He knew he had been seen and was scared and that is why he wrote “I shall no longer announce when I do my murders they shall look like accidents and robberies and such”..... Bullshit... We got ya! He should have been caught a long time ago! That’s what my Grandfather said! I think this case is far more simple than we have made it and I think Don Bujok is Zodiac. that's right Kevin Brooks thinks Donald Lee Bujok is Zodiac! I could be wrong as it could be TK! I hope the prints are a match and I hope the partial DNA will help and perhaps there is more buried somewhere?

I was lazy enough to only make the points along Kevins excellent post. Thanks Kevin. And as you last said. You could be wrong. And I could be wrong. But my bet is on this one. But I leave the window open for partners in crime. The Zodiacs excorcist letter combined with Badlands and Bujoks Excorcist letter combined with his cartoonviolence letter is too much coincidence. But ofcourse Edwards or Dryman could have sent those letters. Wasnt Edwards first murder sentence in Billings?

You have a detectives mind my friend..... . I love it someone who thinks like me.....
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:07 pm

My theory is that he went to Vallejo because he knew it was his buddies back yard Ed Edwards & Dryman. He would impress them; that was a big thing to these cons. Read Edwards book! Another thing I'm not clear on is that he was a salesman for a company in the early 70's and I wonder if Cali was his sales turf? My contacts met with him they said he was as neat as a pin as a salesman! ! I think his sales turf may have included Vallejo but again I'm not sure yet..... Remember too Bujok was Bipolar and probably Schizoid as well... So, that would mean he could stay up for days at times..... He probably had two selves.... the Dudley Do right and Zodiac. By the way, he worked for a chemical company. Ckevin rbrooks
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:01 pm

Zodiac
The True Story of Donald Lee Bujok America’s most sought after serial killer and the Deer Lodge Prison connection that helped solved the mystery of his identity




1.
Zodiac Killer contact information
My name is Kevin Robert Brooks and I have been working on this case since 2007. My Grandfather Robert M. Slavin was a 1st grade Detective in New York City in the 50’s and 60’s. He inspired me as he told me stories of long past both walking the beat and as a detective. He also taught me investigative skills that have proven priceless.
The information I have posted here is about the infamous Zodiac Killer of California. I have uncovered his identity in hopes of giving surviving victims closure and to help law enforcement understand why they failed to capture him when he was active in the late 60’s and 70’s. Special thanks go to Julia Brewer Director of the Montana Prison Museum at Deer Lodge in providing the material to uncover the identity of this brutal killer. From the bottom of my heart, thank you Julia! Thank you to my beautiful wife Bernice and my daughter Celisse. Mom and Steve, maybe things will get better. I love you all! Thank you Robert Barrar for always being there and being a friend…
Don Bujak: Born: July 6th 1936 in Roundup, Montana died October 28th 1993 in Roundup, Montana. He was 57 years old. Don’s Father was Frank Bujok and his mother was Agnes Bujok. His mother’s maiden name was Zulevic.
Donald Lee Bujok: Stationed at Fort Ord, California Monterey Bay 1954 discharged that same year for psychological reasons; #369 Bipolar Disorder

copyright 2011 Kevin R. Brooks
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:14 pm

Kevin B wrote:
Zodiac
The True Story of Donald Lee Bujok America’s most sought after serial killer and the Deer Lodge Prison connection that helped solved the mystery of his identity
..The information I have posted here is about the infamous Zodiac Killer of California. I have uncovered his identity...
copyright 2011 Kevin R. Brooks

I guess I have a few questions. Kevin, what is your primary prove for Bujok being the Zodiac? What is your primary prove to have uncovered Zodiac's identity? I hope I am not getting into copyright infringement by just quoting the above.. it had been previously posted, right? And it wasn't copyrighted then.. Very Happy

What is actually copyrighted? Bujoks biographical info? Let's try to be clear on that, please. We had a thread re Bujok and we all contributed with tidbits of information. Where is this heading now? I thought we are all here to help families and friends of the victims. Just making clear.

-Nin
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:22 pm

Every person has the right and ability to copyright their posts and any other writing. Thankfully most dont! But we all have that right. But nins question is valid in re on what basis do you claim the case is solved? Picture and handwriting or prints and dna?
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:45 pm

Please don't get alarmed it's just an idea for a book name. Anytime you put pen to paper or computer in an original form it is automatically copy righted. I have a lot more information and I really do want to share it but I can't yet I'm sorry. I appreciate the help all of you have been, I really do. Morph was right, this is harder than you'd think to get everything done....
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:03 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
Every person has the right and ability to copyright their posts and any other writing...

I was not aware of that. But then, what is actually copyrighted in Kevin's post - for example ( Kevin, that's just informative talking, nothing against your rights and finds)? I assume I cannnot quote without Kevin's permission? But then, I can go ahead and post biographical information, since it is publicly accessible, correct? The mere fact that Kevin summed up already known facts ( the wheres and whens) is only copyrighted in this original wording but not per se, correct? And since we had a thread about the possibility Bujok may be involved in the Zodiac case - himself or as a partner- the step to connect him as being a viable Zodiac poi was a subjective given, no?

Hey, this is interesting. Smile

-Nin
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:09 pm

Kevin B wrote:
Please don't get alarmed it's just an idea for a book name. Anytime you put pen to paper or computer in an original form it is automatically copy righted. I have a lot more information and I really do want to share it but I can't yet I'm sorry. I appreciate the help all of you have been, I really do. Morph was right, this is harder than you'd think to get everything done....

That's okay. If you have hard evidence to identify Bujok as the Zodiac, I understand where you are going to. I am just a bit disappointed though that you are unable or unwilling to share your proof(s) with us. I thought that's why we are all here and working together. If everything is copyrighted the second you post it, why the secrecy?

-Nin
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:12 pm

Generally ideas cannot be copyrighted only the specific expression of ideas. but those can be quoted for noncommercial fair use.
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:13 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
Generally ideas cannot be copyrighted only the specific expression of ideas. but those can be quoted for noncommercial fair use.

Okay, thanks, good enough.

-Nin
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:41 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
Generally ideas cannot be copyrighted only the specific expression of ideas. but those can be quoted for noncommercial fair use.

Completely correct! That's why I said don't be alarmed. I can say I think Bujok is Zodiac but it doesn't mean I have rights to that statement but only what I have written in the form I have written.
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:02 am

Assuming Bujok was the Zodiac, imagine the lump in his throat when Hartnell lived and the Deer Lodge MT reference hit the news (actually, I can't recall when or if it actually hit the papers as Deer Lodge). And then after that, to go on and start blabbing about slaves in afterlife, again assuming guards and inmates were familiar with this idea of his. Risky, he must have known LE was hot footing it to Montana..

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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:51 am

Nin wrote:
Kevin B wrote:
Please don't get alarmed it's just an idea for a book name. Anytime you put pen to paper or computer in an original form it is automatically copy righted. I have a lot more information and I really do want to share it but I can't yet I'm sorry. I appreciate the help all of you have been, I really do. Morph was right, this is harder than you'd think to get everything done....

That's okay. If you have hard evidence to identify Bujok as the Zodiac, I understand where you are going to. I am just a bit disappointed though that you are unable or unwilling to share your proof(s) with us. I thought that's why we are all here and working together. If everything is copyrighted the second you post it, why the secrecy?

-Nin


That's not true Nin. I have shared everything I can ... I have even given Morf confidential materials because I trust him. That was in case something happened to me. When I did post I was attacked like I was Dennis Kaufman or Debra Perez. I'm not trying to make the evidence fit the suspect but this suspect fits the evidence! I saved those posts because they are important. There is no secrecy but I have to listen to a good friend who is a very high profile attorney. Don Bujok was almost 5'10" and 200 pounds just the size I wrote in an earlier post I thought he would be. He wore thick, thick black framed glasses. Even when he was older he wore them! I have pictures! He was scary as shit looking even when he as he aged! He aged quick too at 47 he looked 67 and only lived to the age of 57.

He had an awful family life. He was a loner. He was left back his first year of school! He at times worked as a ranch hand! He worked for a railroad (railroad punch peek through the pines postcard) and a salesman for a chemical company. Think like a detective! They would hog-tie the prisoners at times at Deer Lodge! Where do you think he learned to 'hog tie' Bryan Hartnell and Cecilia Shepard like that so fast?? I was told by my friend Julia Brewer the guards would hog-tie the prisoners at times at Deer Lodge! Do we think he learned it writing for an underground newspaper in SF? Or could it have been as a ranch hand or prisoner? He was in a prison where they had the only performing theater in the country and maybe the Mikado was performed there!

The themes of the letters are the same!!!! Dick Tracy- The Badlands... The Exorcist: In both letters he said Exorcism was bullshit! Think like a detective. He walked with the same walk Policeman Faulk wrote of a shuffling lope! . He had the military haircut Mike Mageau testified to with the little pompadour up front. The only credible testimony is Mike Mageau’s first in my opinion; after that he went nuts from drugs and the trauma he went through... Bujok had the same unusual speech pattern! He had the pot stomach! He had a military background and was familiar with guns! His hair was receded just like the composite that the 4 kids who saw him help create and was refined by patrolman Faulk! He even had a red tinge to his hair! He was two people! One was Dudley Do-right the other Zodiac the killer who wanted revenge and to collect slaves for his after-life. Go with what you know! I don’t invent evidence like some (Kaufman, Perez)

Bryan Hartnell said “he thought at first the hooded man looked low class and uneducated do to his sloppy dress (shirt hanging out, old man pleated pants stomach hanging over”) But as he spoke with the hooded man he could see he was not stupid… Remember again the tire tracks…. Unless someone is stupid or they have no money would they ride around in a car with worn mismatched tires! This too points to a poor man! The evidence points to a poor man! Bujok was poor! The molds of the tires were also 52 inches apart (inside to inside) just like the “ Light Brown” Skylark he drove.
The only thing I can do is wait. I have a small amount of handwriting that looks good to me but has some weird shit in it like he was trying to be a smart-ass…. I’m a lot smarter than I have been given credit for on this board. But that’s OK. Once the prints and writing is done we will know. I think I have found this man. I think the story is sad even for Bujok, as his life was shit…. It’s no wonder he turned out like he did.

His Father was an alcoholic gambler, his mother suffered from the same mental illness he did (bi-polar) and he had Myotonic Dystrophy on top of that. He was also part of the riot at Deer Lodge Montana! He spent the first 2 years of his prison sentence in Warm Springs State Hospital (57'-58" and the 1st year in maximum security 59' as he was a part in that riot! By Gun, by rope, by kinife, by fire! For God’s sake people look at the 61’ mug shot! It’s him! Does Edwards look like the composite? No! Does Dryman? No! He told us who he was twice! There is the possibility I might be getting a video of Don as well. He walks like the duck, he talked like the duck, he looks like the duck and acted like the duck…….. I'm no longer going to let people get to me... I have worked my ass off on this interviewing people for hours and hours...

Copyright Kevin Brooks 2011
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 1:57 am

Personally, I think the whole copyright thing is a little overboard, and the assumption that Bujok was the Zodiac, a little premature. I guess the majority of us agree, until we see writing samples, more recent photos, etc, or until the police announce that Bujok was Zodiac, we will assume the case is still open. I have yet to see any proof that Bujok was ever in Vallejo. Dont get me wrong, the fact he got out of Deer Lodge 3 days before the Z murders started, and Z later told Hartnell he was from Deer Lodge, mixed with his letters to the editor, all makes him an interesting suspect, but based on the info we have about him, it is so far, circumstantial. I do hope Kevin is right and the case is solved, but I have some doubts.
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PostSubject: Back to ya Morph   Thu Sep 29, 2011 7:59 am

morf13 wrote:
Personally, I think the whole copyright thing is a little overboard, and the assumption that Bujok was the Zodiac, a little premature. I guess the majority of us agree, until we see writing samples, more recent photos, etc, or until the police announce that Bujok was Zodiac, we will assume the case is still open. I have yet to see any proof that Bujok was ever in Vallejo. Dont get me wrong, the fact he got out of Deer Lodge 3 days before the Z murders started, and Z later told Hartnell he was from Deer Lodge, mixed with his letters to the editor, all makes him an interesting suspect, but based on the info we have about him, it is so far, circumstantial. I do hope Kevin is right and the case is solved, but I have some doubts.


I agree it's circumstantial however many cases have been won on strong circumstantial evidence. But, when so many things line up and they have, and do, the odds look pretty good. I believe the handwriting will come back as a match as will the finger prints. I may end up looking like a fool and I'm ready to take that, but let's wait and see before we start throwing darts again.
The idea for the copyright was not mine but if I intend to write a book with the information I have found you have to. You all can too! Remember, you all helped a great deal with this! This great board is about speaking your case and just being you. Zam, Morf, Rand, and Tracers I consider you good people as my friends! I won't forget that. That would not be right! I loved TH as a suspect. Still do! I like Morf's ideas as well... I looked at Arthur Lee, spoke many times with WJG as well as Kane, Houton and Gaik but no one touched me like Bujok... Hey that could be a song!

You know I could be wrong but with what I have..... I just have a gut feeling.... Listen, if it wasn't for Julia Brewer helping me out helping me I would not have found the 2nd mug. Also Tracer's hard work and Morf's great researching skills! He encouraged me to dig!! That is why we on this board (if it is him) found him....support! I have been the victim of ignorant people that think only their suspect is the one and that is a sign of a very poor detective. I have seen people called names chastised and have cruel things written about them. I’m still open to say I could very well be wrong but I don't think so. As we all know only hard evidence will tell for sure! I have it! Does it match? I consider theforeigner brilliant; as I do Rand, Tracers and Morph and many others... You guys are what make this so much fun! If we have Zodiac than we go on to another!

Copyright Kevin Brooks 2011
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:49 am

Okay.

Copyright "Nin" 2011 Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 11:53 am

You have done a lot of investigating Kevin. I hope it works out for you! I know folks will feel a lot better when there is more info you can offer, but we understand why you can't share it.

You also have to understand that all WE (us not you) really have is a photo to compare with the composite....and unfortunately, too many men look like the darn thing! I actually think Dryman looks a lot like that composite if you compare it to his photo at the time he was at Deer Lodge--and in his younger years without a buzz-cut, he had curly, blondish hair.

Mike Mageau's police report statement stated his attacker had "curly" hair and I still question whether Zodiac even wore glasses, so once again, I don't count so much on the composite drawings and looking at photos of guys who wore glasses!

Another concern of mine, and I know you have discussed Bujok's travels, is...would he have been so free to travel that he was able to commit the LHR murders, go home, come back 6 months later, commit the BRS murders, go home, come back and commit the LB attack hang out a few days and commit the SF attack, go home and mail letters...? OR, do you think he was in California the entire time?

Let me say this. I am one who isn't confident Zodiac was the LB attacker, so in the long run, even if I don't think Bujok, Dryman or Edwards was Zodiac I wouldn't rule them out for being Cecelia and Bryan's attacker that day. Although the attacker sounded "young" to Bryan and Slaight....so we could probably rule out Edwards.

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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:31 pm

I think I have shown a lot more info than many people have. You should see my phone bill! Even Tom Voigt hates me now.... Hope he doesn't get personal.... I can't stand that


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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:34 pm

[quote="tahoe27"]You have done a lot of investigating Kevin. I hope it works out for you! I know folks will feel a lot better when there is more info you can offer, but we understand why you can't share it.

You also have to understand that all WE (us not you) really have is a photo to compare with the composite....and unfortunately, too many men look like the darn thing! I actually think Dryman looks a lot like that composite if you compare it to his photo at the time he was at Deer Lodge--and in his younger years without a buzz-cut, he had curly, blondish hair.

Mike Mageau's police report statement stated his attacker had "curly" hair and I still question whether Zodiac even wore glasses, so once again, I don't count so much on the composite drawings and looking at photos of guys who wore glasses!

Another concern of mine, and I know you have discussed Bujok's travels, is...would he have been so free to travel that he was able to commit the LHR murders, go home, come back 6 months later, commit the BRS murders, go home, come back and commit the LB attack hang out a few days and commit the SF attack, go home and mail letters...? OR, do you think he was in California the entire time?

Let me say this. I am one who isn't confident Zodiac was the LB attacker, so in the long run, even if I don't think Bujok, Dryman or Edwards was Zodiac I wouldn't rule them out for being Cecelia and Bryan's attacker that day. Although the attacker sounded "young" to Bryan and Slaight....so we could probably rule out Edwards.



Answer:

He didn't wear glasses in the mug shot but he did wear glasses most of the time in the pictures I have of him. Why again would it be hard for a person who already killed before to not want to get caught and drive a couple of states over and show his buddies Edward's, Dryman, he meant it when he told them would gather slaves for the after-life. What better place than their back-yards? As I explained before back in 68' once one was paroled the guards would give him money, buy him a bus ticket and watch him across the county line and that was the end of their responsibility. Remember too that Bujok was bipolar... So was Ted Bundy and he traveled quite a bit as well!
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:44 pm

Kevin B wrote:
Just got a rather nasty note from Tom Voight seems he's suddenly a Bujok believer. What happened to Gaik "it's in the cypher"!

I'm sure I've received more nasty emails from him than you, lol. They're actually quite entertaining. Just keep up the good work and don't worry about it. Comes with the territory I guess.
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:08 pm

thebigZ wrote:
Kevin B wrote:
Just got a rather nasty note from Tom Voight seems he's suddenly a Bujok believer. What happened to Gaik "it's in the cypher"!

I'm sure I've received more nasty emails from him than you, lol. They're actually quite entertaining. Just keep up the good work and don't worry about it. Comes with the territory I guess.

If he is a Bujok believer, why a nasty email? Maybe you were being sarcastic?
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PostSubject: Re: More on Don Bujok   Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:06 pm

Everyone, Let's not discuss nasty emails from somebody that is not a member of this site, lets stay on topic, and focus on Bujok.
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