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 HELLO IT'S ME

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morf13
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Jul 16, 2011 11:33 am

Yes it looks similar to me, but an obvious attempt was made to hide the writing. Also, look at the candy cane style F's(although a couple look purposely different, the writer does include a natural looking candy cane f), and we must look closely at the letter K....is it a 2 stroke, or 3?
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AK Wilks
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:15 pm

The FBI did not give Morf the ENVELOPE the Atlanta Zodiac letter "HELLO ITS ME" came in.

I just got it.

I had resubmitted my request for 4 Zodiac letters, dropping the request for analysis documents after the "hint" I got from the Justice Department Office of Information Services (and passed on to Morf). The others are the San Jose 1969 letter, the 1978 typed letter and most important the 1971 "In the woods dies April...Monticello" letter.

The envelope is addressed to 1611 W Peachtree ST NE 30308 (or maybe 30808?).

There is a NASA space shuttle sticker in the upper right, it appears to be a special collectors envelope???

Or a special machince cancel? Anyone have any idea how to find out where this machine cancel was used?

See http://spacecovers.com/cgi-bin/cimagedisp/cimagedisp.cgi?tag=P&list_id=PILOT02&item_id=2165A

The stamp is from the Americana Series, the US Flag and the words THE LAND OF THE FREE THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

Now here is where it gets a little interesting ...

Out of this 20 or 22 stamp AMERICANA collection, we have this stamp used on the Zodiac Atlanta letter, and also the Eagle Shield and Flag stamp used on the May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter, the one sent to the LA TV station that referenced a death list and the Manson family.

ALSO...another stamp in this set was used by the Unabomber, AMERICAS LIGHT FUELED BY TRUTH AND REASON, RUSH LAMP.

See http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t828-1981-possible-zodiac-atlanta-letter-the-envelope





AMERICANA SERIES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON 1981 POSSIBLE ATLANTA ZODIAC LETTER



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON FOUR UNABOMBER MAILBOMBS 1979 1980 1985 1985



MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES ENVELOPE WITH AMERICANA SERIES STAMP EAGLE AND SHIELD

[

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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:03 am



COMPARE THE AT in ATKID with the AT in ATTN below:

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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:40 am

rand wrote:


COMPARE THE AT in ATKID with the AT in ATTN below:


I think, but I am not sure, that the ATKID written on the envelope was done by a FBI agent. All records, and documents in the Atlanta Child murders, have the word ATKID on them. I think that was the code name for their investigation.
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:42 pm

Text of May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter and March 1981 Possible Zodiac letter.

Both letters had a stamp from the same 4 stamp sheet from the Americana Series.

Both stamps have the red, white and blue.

Both texts are racist, taunting and mocking.

Both attempt to (mis)lead police into linking Zodiac into other crimes (Manson, Atlanta Child Murders).

Similar shaky handwriting?

Same Zodiac?

Same hoaxer?







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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Wed Jul 27, 2011 4:42 pm



Look at the strange "S" in the Atlanta Zodiac envelope.

Now look at the similarly weird "S" on the Riverside poem, it also looks like an upside down "5". Both the Atlanta envelope and the poem have another Zodiac characteristic, a low cross on the "t".




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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:36 pm

Dan this is the envelope notice the cancellation mark.
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:48 am

Text of May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter and March 1981 Possible Zodiac letter.

Both letters had a stamp from the same 4 stamp sheet from the Americana Series.

Both stamps have the red, white and blue.

Both texts are racist, taunting and mocking.

Both attempt to (mis)lead police into linking Zodiac into other crimes (Manson, Atlanta Child Murders).

Similar shaky handwriting?

Same Zodiac?

Same hoaxer?







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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:56 pm



Over at ZKF they noticed something I think Rand noticed a few months ago, which is that the "A" on the Atlanta envelope looks a lot like the "A" on the Riverside possible Hautz envelope.

Good observation and graphic by the Traveller, however I am fairly certain an FBI Agent wrote the FBI case designation "ATKID" on the envelope. Though it damages the evidence to do that. I suppose it is POSSIBLE the letter writer/Zodiac/Hoaxer heard the case name and wrote it on the envelope, but it seems doubtful to me...

Since some folks there are finally showing some interest in the Atlanta letter obtained by Morf and the envelope obtained by me, someone who is a member there might want to point out to them that the writing looks like the May 1978 Zodiac letter and that it uses a stamp from the same set. Meaning either same Zodiac sent both letters or same hoaxer IMO.

You can use all the images below if anyone wants to post this at ZKF, ZK or other sites.

Ted K also used stamps from this series.


Text of May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter and March 1981 Possible Zodiac letter.

Both letters had a stamp from the same 4 stamp sheet from the Americana Series.

Both stamps have the red, white and blue.

Both texts are racist, taunting and mocking.

Both attempt to (mis)lead police into linking Zodiac into other crimes (Manson, Atlanta Child Murders).

Similar shaky handwriting?

Same Zodiac?

Same hoaxer?









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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:02 pm

AK, I saw that discussion, and it is interesting. Just when we think the Hautz letter is dead, it seems to get resurrected Very Happy

Here is what I think, the cursive P in the word PRESS on the Hautz letter, in my mind, is undoubtedly written by Patricia. I have seen her writing, and have no doubt in my mind that she wrote the address for the Press Enterprise. She has confirmed to Butterfield that she wrote letters like that to the Editors about certain issues, although she cant directly remember typing the Bates letter about "the boy turned killer". Perhaps maybe Butterfield should have asked her(maybe he did & I cant remember)whether or not she would type letters to the editors, or handwrite them. We have the letter itself, typed, the address to the Press Enterprise in cursive, and the ATTN EDITOR printed. I find it a little odd that there are 3 different uses for one letter, typing, printing, and cursive.
'IF', and it is a big IF in my mind, somebody other than Patricia wrote the ATTN EDITOR on the envelope, and/or typed the letter inside, then I think it is possible that the person may have likely worked at the newspaper, the Press Enterprise in Riverside during the time it was sent. That person then may have opened a letter from her at the Press enterprise, then simply typed their own note and added it to her envelope. Is there a list of employees there for that time? Can we check to see if any of them then moved up to the Vallejo area during the Z murders? Another possibility is that someone close to Patricia stole an envelope she had already filled out, and used it themselves to mail a letter with the typed note.

Me personally, if I ever wrote a letter to the editor about a murder victim, and a "boy turned killer", I would remember it. It's weird that she cant specifically remember writing that envelope. If I recall, Butterfield did NOT post any of her printed writing. The documents that I have signed by her do NOT include printing, only cursive.

Lastly, do we know for sure that the person that wrote the word ATKID on the Atlanta envelope wasnt a FBI worker writing the cas ename on the letter so that it would be added to the correct case files? The capital A does look similar on both the ATKID letter, and the Bates letter, but the capital A seems like a letter that would be written in a similar way by alot of different people
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:31 pm

Good points Morf. I do NOT know for sure if an agent wrote ATKID on the envelope it seems likely but who knows.
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:54 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
The FBI did not give Morf the ENVELOPE the Atlanta Zodiac letter "HELLO ITS ME" came in.

I just got it.

I had resubmitted my request for 4 Zodiac letters, dropping the request for analysis documents after the "hint" I got from the Justice Department Office of Information Services (and passed on to Morf). The others are the San Jose 1969 letter, the 1978 typed letter and most important the 1971 "In the woods dies April...Monticello" letter.

The envelope is addressed to 1611 W Peachtree ST NE 30308 (or maybe 30808?).

There is a NASA space shuttle sticker in the upper right, it appears to be a special collectors envelope???

Or a special machince cancel? Anyone have any idea how to find out where this machine cancel was used?

See http://spacecovers.com/cgi-bin/cimagedisp/cimagedisp.cgi?tag=P&list_id=PILOT02&item_id=2165A

The stamp is from the Americana Series, the US Flag and the words THE LAND OF THE FREE THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

Now here is where it gets a little interesting ...

Out of this 20 or 22 stamp AMERICANA collection, we have this stamp used on the Zodiac Atlanta letter, and also the Eagle Shield and Flag stamp used on the May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter, the one sent to the LA TV station that referenced a death list and the Manson family.

ALSO...another stamp in this set was used by the Unabomber, AMERICAS LIGHT FUELED BY TRUTH AND REASON, RUSH LAMP.

See http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t828-1981-possible-zodiac-atlanta-letter-the-envelope





AMERICANA SERIES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON 1981 POSSIBLE ATLANTA ZODIAC LETTER



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON FOUR UNABOMBER MAILBOMBS 1979 1980 1985 1985



MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES ENVELOPE WITH AMERICANA SERIES STAMP EAGLE AND SHIELD

[


Assuming I am reading the date on the envelope correctly as March 8, 1981 (don't recall seeing the date elsewhere), then I would have to say it was originally obtained in Houston, Texas but mailed from Atlanta, Georgia. Interesting to note: James A. Chamberlin, a NASA contributor to the design of the Apollo program, passed away on that date.

Have to step away from computer for a very short tad. I will type up some info for you and, provide a couple of links as well, when I come back.
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 29, 2011 5:35 pm

soze wrote:
AK Wilks wrote:
The FBI did not give Morf the ENVELOPE the Atlanta Zodiac letter "HELLO ITS ME" came in.

I just got it.

I had resubmitted my request for 4 Zodiac letters, dropping the request for analysis documents after the "hint" I got from the Justice Department Office of Information Services (and passed on to Morf). The others are the San Jose 1969 letter, the 1978 typed letter and most important the 1971 "In the woods dies April...Monticello" letter.

The envelope is addressed to 1611 W Peachtree ST NE 30308 (or maybe 30808?).

There is a NASA space shuttle sticker in the upper right, it appears to be a special collectors envelope???

Or a special machince cancel? Anyone have any idea how to find out where this machine cancel was used?

See http://spacecovers.com/cgi-bin/cimagedisp/cimagedisp.cgi?tag=P&list_id=PILOT02&item_id=2165A

The stamp is from the Americana Series, the US Flag and the words THE LAND OF THE FREE THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

Now here is where it gets a little interesting ...

Out of this 20 or 22 stamp AMERICANA collection, we have this stamp used on the Zodiac Atlanta letter, and also the Eagle Shield and Flag stamp used on the May 1978 Possible Zodiac letter, the one sent to the LA TV station that referenced a death list and the Manson family.

ALSO...another stamp in this set was used by the Unabomber, AMERICAS LIGHT FUELED BY TRUTH AND REASON, RUSH LAMP.

See http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t828-1981-possible-zodiac-atlanta-letter-the-envelope





AMERICANA SERIES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON 1981 POSSIBLE ATLANTA ZODIAC LETTER



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES



AMERICANA SERIES STAMP USED ON FOUR UNABOMBER MAILBOMBS 1979 1980 1985 1985



MAY 1978 POSSIBLE ZODIAC LETTER LOS ANGELES ENVELOPE WITH AMERICANA SERIES STAMP EAGLE AND SHIELD

[


Assuming I am reading the date on the envelope correctly as March 8, 1981 (don't recall seeing the date elsewhere), then I would have to say it was originally obtained in Houston, Texas but mailed from Atlanta, Georgia. Interesting to note: James A. Chamberlin, a NASA contributor to the design of the Apollo program, passed away on that date.

Have to step away from computer for a very short tad. I will type up some info for you and, provide a couple of links as well, when I come back.


I am interested in the possible HOUSTON TX connection, please do elaborate.
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soze
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sat Oct 29, 2011 8:03 pm

The USPS began its space exploration stamps with the Project Mercury stamp on February 20, 1962. As enthusiasm grew for America’s race to the moon, more and more people began collecting these stamps. From that enthusiasm, sprang up what is known as, space-stamp clubs. These space-stamp clubs were located at, or near, NASA facilities working on the Mercury, Gemini and Apollo missions. James A Chamberlin, as stated previously, contributed to the design of NASA’s Apollo program and passed away on the date this letter was post marked. He also worked on the design of NASA’s Gemini spacecraft.

Getting back to the space-stamp club, they created special postal cancellations to record the history of space exploration, among other things. However, it should be noted, that not all of these space stamp cancellations came from them. Some of these cancellation designs came from the U.S. Navy. The sailors who operated the post office on, the carriers sent out to retrieve astronauts after re-entry to earth, created their own cancellation stamps to commemorate their ship’s involvement. I don’t believe that’s the case with this particular cancellation stamp.

There is also what is called a Space City Cover Society. It’s a society of local, Houston area residents, who are space enthusiasts. They created their own NASA cancellations per postal regulations. Of the ones I have seen, they are stamps and not anything like the cancellation marks we see on the March 8, 1981 letter. According to the second link provided below, their stamps also have to have regular first class postage and must be cancelled at any U.S. post office. I have found only one address for them and it is:

Space City
PO Box 36192
Houston TX 77236

Anyway, the Gemini mission developed space travel techniques geared toward the future support of the Apollo missions, of which, had the goal of landing men on the moon. All manned flights of the Gemini project launched from Cape Canaveral, Florida. Apollo flights launched from the Kennedy Space Center, also, in Florida.

Both projects were managed by the Manned Spacecraft Center in Houston, Texas. This is where all the headcheese’s, like Chamberlin, operated from. This center is now known to be the Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center or just Johnson. This facility does have a space-stamp society and their information is as follows:

Johnson Space Center Stamp Club
P.O. Box 58247, Houston, TX
77258-8247

Contact name: Verne Harms
Email: vepaperbag@aol.com

I guess for me, it just seems to be the more logical location, considering. But perhaps, Verne can confirm or deny what it is my opinion.

Further, this reminds me of my trip to Florida this past Christmas. On my way back, I stopped off at the Huntsville site to have a look around. I know I made a comment about it at Zodiackiller.com but I don’t recall whether I went into detail. When you walk into the main facility that has a life size version of one the spacecrafts, there was a wall of numerous pictures and descriptions of events. One of these pictures really caught my eye in terms of the Zodiac’s ciphers. It was camera symbols imbedded within the photo itself. Got me wondering. Didn’t have a camera with me and so I don’t have an image to show. I am only a couple of hours from there. Perhaps I will go back.

Soze


http://www.nasa.gov/50th/50th_magazine/pushingTheEnvelope.html

http://spacecovers.com/misc/nasalp.htm

http://www.spaceandastronomystamps.com/nas02.xhtml

http://www.texasphilatelic.org/chapters/johnsonspacecenter.htm
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:19 am

Very interesting, is there anyway to find a list of members that belonged to this space stamp club? I know this possible Donna Lass suspect lived in the Houston area:
http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t814-interesting-lass-zodiac-suspect
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soze
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:23 pm

morf13 wrote:
Very interesting, is there anyway to find a list of members that belonged to this space stamp club? I know this possible Donna Lass suspect lived in the Houston area:
http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t814-interesting-lass-zodiac-suspect

I would start with the space stamp club at Johnson first, contacting Verne in a separate email from that of, the cancellation stamp. Who knows. They may have such a list. Interested in that list myself. Plan to look on the net first before contacting Verne though. If I come across anything I will post it here.

To be frank, though, I am actually a bit more interested in who was at "mission control" than I am this club.

Soze
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:05 pm

Not sure that the special collectors envelope was only available in Houston, though I agree it would have been there because of the clubs and space connection.

There is a NASA space shuttle sticker in the upper right, it appears to be a special collectors envelope???

Or a special machince cancel? Anyone have any idea how to find out where this machine cancel was used?

See http://spacecovers.com/cgi-bin/cimagedisp/cimagedisp.cgi?tag=P&list_id=PILOT02&item_id=2165A








Last edited by AK Wilks on Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:16 pm; edited 2 times in total
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soze
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Mon Oct 31, 2011 12:11 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
Not sure that the special collectors envelope was only available in Houston, though I agree it would have been there because of the clubs and space connection.

There is a NASA space shuttle sticker in the upper right, it appears to be a special collectors envelope???

Or a special machince cancel? Anyone have any idea how to find out where this machine cancel was used?

See http://spacecovers.com/cgi-bin/cimagedisp/cimagedisp.cgi?tag=P&list_id=PILOT02&item_id=2165A

Why would you think that this would be a "special collector's envelope"?

There are three types of special collector's envelopes that I am aware of:

1. Space Commemorative Event Covers:
These covers have postmarks dating the cover to a particular space event, always the same day this event occurs and, usually from the area it occurred at.

2. Space First Day Covers:
First day covers come out with the issue of a new postal service space stamp and will be hand stamped "First Day of Issue".

3. Space Covers with a Cachet:
Cachet's are elaborate pictures with text, usually in multicolor, explaining the events that occurred. They can be either printed directly on the envelope, stamped with a rubber stamp or are stickers affixed to the envelope. They are typically found on the left side of the envelope, although, they can be found anywhere on the envelope including the whole front side.

The envelope dated March 8, 1981 has neither of those qualities in my opinion, unless, we should count Jim Chamberlin’s death. Would be twisted irony.

What’s interesting to note is that the cancellation symbol used on the March 8, 1981 letter was part of the insignia for STS-1 Columbia test flight launched on April 12, 1981 from Edwards, California. This is the same STS-1 flight commemorated on the envelope you provided a link for.

The artist for the STS-1 insignia was Robert McCall and it would appear he was the artist for the cancellation on the March 8, 1981 envelope as well. (Second link provides a date of insignia design as 1979. Do not know the accuracy.) Robert McCall did mostly space art in the form of U.S. Postage stamps and NASA mission patches. However, he also did work for Life magazine and at least two, motion pictures: 1. 2001: A Space Odyssey and 2. Star Trek: The Motion Picture.

Construction began on the STS-1 Columbia in 1975 by a company named Rockwell International (Formerly known as North American Aviation but now known as Boeing International). This facility was located in Palmdale, California, a suburb of Los Angeles. STS-1 Columbia was named after two things, more importantly, the Apollo 11 Command Module. The Apollo 11 Command Module, was also built by, North American Aviation. CEO of the time was John Leland Atwood.

http://history.nasa.gov/sts1/images.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sts-1-patch.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Columbia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_Command/Service_Module

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Aviation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Leland_Atwood

Soze
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:30 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
EXCELLENT!!!

That IS the famous never before seen until now "Atlanta Child Murders" - "Zodiac" letter!

It was postmarked "Atlanta, GA March 8, 1981".

I wrote about it before:

I am doing a FOIA request for this letter mentioned in the FBI Atlanta Child Murders file.

It says it is from the Zodiac, and the FBI handwriting analyst could not say it was from Zodiac, but he could NOT exclude it as being from Zodiac.

All we know is it starts:

"Hello its me. Haven't you..."







Another letter is this time frame, perhaps also from this "Zodiac", was a demand that the Washington Post classified run this ad as a secret message:

DANIEL PLEASE CALL HOME




At almost the same time, a message was sent in the same way as the Zodiac Sacramento Cancer and Leo cards - in a prepaid envelope.

This letter was treated as credible, there are 10 pages on it in the files, and 3 kids were killed that March in Atlanta.

Only three cities got this insert for classic model cars that the message came in - Harrisburg PA, Chicago IL and Long Beach FLA.




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"Back when I was picking beans in Guatemala, we used to make fresh coffee, right off the trees I mean. That was good. This is shit but, hey, I'm in a police station"
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PostSubject: Re: HELLO IT'S ME   Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:32 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
Perhaps Morf or someone else knows more about the envelope. All I know is what is stated below - there was an address, but it is covered up.



_________________


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"Back when I was picking beans in Guatemala, we used to make fresh coffee, right off the trees I mean. That was good. This is shit but, hey, I'm in a police station"
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