Zodiackillersite

DISCUSSION ABOUT THE ZODIAC KILLER - ALWAYS FREE TO JOIN, NO FEES EVER!
 
HomeHome  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

Share | 
 

 Paul Avery

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
morf13
Admin
avatar

Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 46
Location : NJ

PostSubject: Paul Avery   Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:02 am

Paul Avery was a major player in the Zodiac story. He wrote many Zodiac articles. He was the guy that broke the link between Zodiac & Cheri Jo Bates. He also received the infamous Halloween card from Zodiac warning him "You are doomed"






Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 1:28 am

I've done primary research on Avery for about a year and a half now. I can say, without a doubt, that Paul Avery was one of the most remarkable reporters who has ever lived. He's one of my great heroes and I have and will always have tremendous affection for him. Researching his life has been nothing but a joy.

If anyone is interested in Avery, please consider picking up a copy of his out-of-print book The Voices Of Guns : http://www.amazon.com/voices-guns-definitive-twenty-two-month-Symbionese/dp/0399117385/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1268976341&sr=8-1


If anyone has any specific questions I'd love to take a shot at answering them!
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
avatar

Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 46
Location : NJ

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 8:05 am

I definitely think that if any reporter could have found out Zodiac's ID, it would have been Avery.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 1:28 pm

I can't speculate, but I think you're absolutely right.
Back to top Go down
Nin
Chief
avatar

Posts : 582
Join date : 2010-03-07

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 2:33 pm

morf13 wrote:
I definitely think that if any reporter could have found out Zodiac's ID, it would have been Avery.

That means we have to think like Avery - or like Zodiac of course.. Wink

-Nin
Back to top Go down
bentley
Chief
avatar

Posts : 1340
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : Bayarea

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 3:10 pm

BrittaMoline wrote:

If anyone has any specific questions I'd love to take a shot at answering them!

There is a post somewhere on one of the boards from someone who knew Avery, stating he had come across a suspect of his own, I believe some years after his involvement. Any idea who that was?
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 6:46 pm

bentley wrote:

There is a post somewhere on one of the boards from someone who knew Avery, stating he had come across a suspect of his own, I believe some years after his involvement. Any idea who that was?

Can you remember where the post was? If I could see it, I could give it a shot. Avery moved around a lot so it's impossible to know each person he was in touch with.
Back to top Go down
bentley
Chief
avatar

Posts : 1340
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : Bayarea

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 6:54 pm

Wow, that was easy..

http://www.zodiackiller.com/mba/ozs/342.html
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Fri Mar 19, 2010 7:27 pm

Ah yes, I remember this post. Until I get more information on the post/er I'm skeptical. Like Voigt's reply, Avery was really uninterested in the Zodiac beyond the late 70's and found people pursuing him about Zodiac leads to be more irritating than informative. He kept a stack of Zodiac letters in his house or office (I forgot which) and would periodically open them to laugh and throw away. He wasn't seriously investigating into the 90s.

HOWEVER! Avery was a lifelong and dogged investigator. It's very possible something piqued his interest. I find this post difficult to believe, but if more info were to ever come through I'd gladly welcome it.

If Thomas Richardson had said where he knew Avery from/how he got in contact with him, that would be a lot of help.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help to all of you.
Back to top Go down
Zamantha
Chief
avatar

Posts : 2053
Join date : 2010-03-05
Location : Planet Earth

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat Dec 11, 2010 1:02 am

http://articles.sfgate.com/2000-12-13/news/17673371_1_zodiac-killer-paul-avery-mr-avery

I'd like to thank Britta for making me aware of this article* She is a hugh Paul Avery Fan.
Ten Year Anniversary of this Death. I can say this is one guy I would of loved to have meant
an sat in one of those SF Bars and talked about his Z experiences.


Last edited by Zamantha on Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
tahoe27
Chief
avatar

Posts : 2920
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : Lake Tahoe

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 1:45 pm

Who is this guy? Obviously not one of the two officers.

During an off-hour card game at the Hall of Justice one quiet afternoon, Paul was sitting in along with one of two policemen who responded to the shooting call that night, briefly stopping a stocky white male who was walking rapidly away from the scene but letting him go after a dispatcher put out that the suspect was black.

"I'll always wonder, did I just let the Zodiac slip through my fingers," Sgt. Jerry Senkir said, and Paul would peer at him and intone for the hundredth time: "What did you say he looked like, again?"

http://www.eastbaydaze.com/2009/10/zodiac-case-still-haunts-40-years-later.html
Back to top Go down
Nachtsider
Chief
avatar

Posts : 927
Join date : 2010-04-20
Age : 30
Location : Behind you

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 2:40 pm

He could have substituted Fouke's name with a pseudonym.
Back to top Go down
http://www.facebook.com/Nachtsider
tracers
Chief
avatar

Posts : 530
Join date : 2010-03-06

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 3:29 pm

Well, this reporter can't even get the sequence of events right, IF they are talking about Fouke and Zelms. Also, Fouke swears to this day that he and Zelms never stopped anyone. So either this reporter has everything screwed up, or there was another encounter no one knows about? Is that even possible?
Back to top Go down
tracers
Chief
avatar

Posts : 530
Join date : 2010-03-06

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 3:48 pm

This is a strange article to say the least. Look at this portion:

Quote :

"Quite a case... quite a case," he would say whenever someone convinced him to drag out the dog-eared copy of the Halloween Card the killer sent him, dirty with fingerprint dust, and we would look at him and nod. Zodiac was that kind of a case, dragging in police and scribes alike, getting into their blood.

so, are we now to believe that for years Paul Avery had the Halloween card that was dusted for prints and would pull it out and show it to people? Or does the reporter mean Paul had a xeroxed copy of the card? If so, why would that have been dusted for prints? Is the reporter referring to the card that was reportedly sent to Johns and forwarded to Avery and which Avery said he never got?

Who wrote this article anyway and what time period are they remembering?? I can't tell from what I read in that link. If I missed that info, sorry. I am assuming Duffy Jennings wrote this, but of course that may not be the case.
Back to top Go down
tahoe27
Chief
avatar

Posts : 2920
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : Lake Tahoe

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 4:05 pm

I don't know, but apparenly they are in the "Orinda" area. Wink


(We're talking about Orinda on another thread today)

http://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t748p30-the-zodiac-is-going-to-postcard-from-10-12-70
Back to top Go down
Seagull
Chief
avatar

Posts : 1150
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : No. California

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 4:16 pm

In the California Birth Index there is a Jerome Senkir listed as having been born in SF in 1947. He would have been 22 in 1969 when the Stine murder happened and could have been a rookie I suppose. He is not listed in the Social Security Death Index so he's probably still around.
Back to top Go down
http://www.santarosahitchhikermurders.com
tracers
Chief
avatar

Posts : 530
Join date : 2010-03-06

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 4:21 pm

Looks like Senkir was/is a cop:

A march 20, 2003 article


http://articles.sfgate.com/2003-03-20/bay-area/17483545_1_grand-jury-transcript-chief-earl-sanders-tsenin


Quote :
The judge ordered stricken from the publicly released transcript any references to a remark made by Jerome Senkir, a sergeant at the department's management control division who was involved in the internal investigation.

Tsenin said the comments by Senkir, whom she called "a minor witness," were "incredibly inflammatory," could be misunderstood and probably would not be admitted into evidence anyway.

Senkir was an acting supervisor the morning of the Nov. 20 incident, while Harold Butler was the investigator in the case. The judge ordered portions of Butler's testimony sealed, along with parts of the testimony of Sgt. John Fewer of Park Station.

Back to top Go down
Theforeigner
Chief
avatar

Posts : 880
Join date : 2010-03-06
Age : 61
Location : Denmark

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 5:09 pm

tracers wrote:
Looks like Senkir was/is a cop:

A march 20, 2003 article


http://articles.sfgate.com/2003-03-20/bay-area/17483545_1_grand-jury-transcript-chief-earl-sanders-tsenin


Quote :
The judge ordered stricken from the publicly released transcript any references to a remark made by Jerome Senkir, a sergeant at the department's management control division who was involved in the internal investigation.

Tsenin said the comments by Senkir, whom she called "a minor witness," were "incredibly inflammatory," could be misunderstood and probably would not be admitted into evidence anyway.

Senkir was an acting supervisor the morning of the Nov. 20 incident, while Harold Butler was the investigator in the case. The judge ordered portions of Butler's testimony sealed, along with parts of the testimony of Sgt. John Fewer of Park Station.


Shocked
This is IMO mindblowing!!!
I mean were EXACTLY! and with WHOM! was this Jerry/Jerome Senkir in the first 1-30 minnutes after Zodiac left Paul Stines car!???
Back to top Go down
tracers
Chief
avatar

Posts : 530
Join date : 2010-03-06

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 5:15 pm

yes, this looks very interesting, but we need to also consider the possibility of bad reporting in terms of the sequence of events described in the article. But I do find it very odd that Senkir is quoted as saying he wonders if he let the Zodiac slip away. So either Senkir liked to look important and lied about stopping the man or he is telling the truth.

Doesn't seem likely Avery would be hanging out with a wanna-be/liar though, does it? He knew the case inside out.
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
avatar

Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 46
Location : NJ

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 6:19 pm

"There has to be some kind of (police) action. At this point it seems to be a political statement on their part not a food give away issue."
SAN FRANCISCO POLICE SPOKESMAN JERRY SENKIR 1988"
Found at: http://zapatista44.blogspot.com/2011/04/illegal-to-feed-hungry-people-orlando.html



""The only thing we're concerned with when we talk with this group is that they don't take law into their own hands," said Sergeant Jerry Senkir. "They don't have police officer status."
Found at: http://sfguardianangels.blogspot.com/2008/09/sfga-history-tenderloin-residents.html



Back to top Go down
tracers
Chief
avatar

Posts : 530
Join date : 2010-03-06

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 10:48 pm

I emailed the author of the article, asking about the encounter Senkir described, the reporter's association with Paul and if Paul had the actual Halloween card in his possession back in the 1980's. Although I asked a number of detailed questions, the reporter did not have many details to provide in their response. Here is what I asked

Quote :

I have some questions I was hoping you might be kind enough to take the time to answer.

1) You write that you worked with Paul Avery in the 1980's. When and where?

Did Paul work or live in Orinda at the time?

What was Paul like?

2) You write that when asked, Paul would take out a copy of the Zodiac killer Halloween card that had finger print dust on it.and let people see it.

Was this card the actual card that had been sent to him by the Zodiac?

What parts seemed to have been made and added to the card by Zodiac?


3) You write that Sgt. Jerry Senkir and Paul sat and play cards and Jerry said, "'I'll always wonder, did I just let the Zodiac slip through my fingers,' Sgt. Jerry Senkir said, and Paul would peer at him and intone for the hundredth time: 'What did you say he looked like, again?'"

Based on what I read so far, two officers named Fouke and Zelms saw a man walking away from the scene on the next street over, but since they had already heard the shooting suspect was a "Negro" or "Black" (I forget the exact term used) they did not stop the man.

According to your story and Senkir's words, Senkir saw a man BEFORE the dispatch stated the suspect was a "Negro" or "Black" and actually stopped the man for a moment. Then heard the dispatch that the suspect wasn't white and let the man go.

Do you remember anything more than Senkir or Paul may have said about this incident of Senkir stopping a white male?

Did he say WHERE he stopped the man? Which street or intersection?

Was Senkir alone in his patrol car or did he have a partner with him?

What did Senkir say the man looked like?

Did his description gel with the composite that has become so well-known?

Do you know if he had any input with creating the composite?

Did Senkir say anything about what else transpired that night or later on after he reported his stopping of a white male near the scene to his superiors?

So far I have only read about two officers named Foukes and Zelms driving past a white male near the Stone scene. It's exciting to find out another officer saw a man too and I wonder if the man he stopped was the same man seen by the other two officers.

Any information you can provide would be so greatly appreciated!



and here is what they wrote back:

Quote :

Hi... Paul and I worked at the San Francisco Examiner. We both lived in the city.

Actual card. Original suspect description was for a black male, Senkir and partner saw a white male heading in the direction of the Presidio that fit later description of Zodiac.

That's all I have beyond an association with a few of the investigators who worked the case later.

Good luck,

JD
_________________
Back to top Go down
Seagull
Chief
avatar

Posts : 1150
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : No. California

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sat May 28, 2011 10:53 pm

Wow, great work ladies! So there is quite possibly another pair of officers who may have seen Zodiac that night. I wonder if those two officers played a part in the revised composite?? Obviously Jerome Senkir should be interviewed. You may have hit on something that was held back from the general public!
Back to top Go down
http://www.santarosahitchhikermurders.com
Nachtsider
Chief
avatar

Posts : 927
Join date : 2010-04-20
Age : 30
Location : Behind you

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sun May 29, 2011 12:17 am

Hmm. So there might just be more to this than meets the eye.

Next stop, Jerome Senkir.
Back to top Go down
http://www.facebook.com/Nachtsider
morf13
Admin
avatar

Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 46
Location : NJ

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Sun May 29, 2011 10:34 am

Interesting stuff....keep digging! cheers
Back to top Go down
Qz1
Sergeant


Posts : 77
Join date : 2011-10-18

PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:35 am

Any developments?
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Paul Avery   

Back to top Go down
 
Paul Avery
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next
 Similar topics
-
» RIP Paul Walker, Brian O'Connor
» Paul McCone.
» Facey & Paul Kane Tourneys??
» 'Fast & Furious' star Paul Walker dies in car accident
» One day until Paul's info - 6:30pm PST will be the reveal time (update)

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Zodiackillersite :: The Zodiac Investigators :: Zodiac Reporters-
Jump to: