Zodiackillersite
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.
Zodiackillersite

DISCUSSION ABOUT THE ZODIAC KILLER - ALWAYS FREE TO JOIN, NO FEES EVER!
 
HomeHome  Latest imagesLatest images  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

 

 Fred Manalli

Go down 
+18
Quicktrader
Quagmire
Zamantha
AK Wilks
trainmaster
duckking2001
doranchak
Jem
Nachtsider
onewhoknows
Luke68
patinky
traveller1st
bentley
morf13
Theforeigner
tahoe27
Seagull
22 posters
Go to page : Previous  1 ... 11 ... 19, 20, 21 ... 28 ... 36  Next
AuthorMessage
Zamantha
Chief
Zamantha


Posts : 2053
Join date : 2010-03-05
Location : Planet Earth

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 10:09 am

thebigZ wrote:
AK Wilks wrote:
Three out of five serial killers prefer references to William Blake...

Laughing
I concor, this one also made me Wink
Back to top Go down
trainmaster
Chief
trainmaster


Posts : 450
Join date : 2011-11-21

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 3:49 pm

The pictures of Manalli came from college photos?

One big difference between now and the 1950's - everybody dressed up for
formal occasions.
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
morf13


Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 52
Location : NJ

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 4:41 pm

trainmaster wrote:
The pictures of Manalli came from college photos?

One big difference between now and the 1950's - everybody dressed up for
formal occasions.

Those were High School photos. Here's one more...of course, Manalli was in the drama club as seen in this photo-holding a sword or stick
Fred Manalli - Page 20 Manall44
Back to top Go down
Zamantha
Chief
Zamantha


Posts : 2053
Join date : 2010-03-05
Location : Planet Earth

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 4:48 pm

morf13 wrote:
trainmaster wrote:
The pictures of Manalli came from college photos?

One big difference between now and the 1950's - everybody dressed up for
formal occasions.

Those were High School photos. Here's one more...of course, Manalli was in the drama club as seen in this photo-holding a sword or stick
Fred Manalli - Page 20 Manall44


Interesting Morf. On the black board...It says The Play is THE THING> Make me think of the Z " Do my Thing"
Back to top Go down
AK Wilks
Chief
AK Wilks


Posts : 4294
Join date : 2010-03-05
Age : 57

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 5:08 pm

A good observation fair Zam but alas methinks that may be a quote from Shakespeare.
Back to top Go down
Zamantha
Chief
Zamantha


Posts : 2053
Join date : 2010-03-05
Location : Planet Earth

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 6:20 pm

AK Wilks wrote:
A good observation fair Zam but alas methinks that may be a quote from Shakespeare.

Thanks AK, but thinking....he still could of liked or copied the verbiage. I know I do that, If I like a saying I tend to use it
now and then. But yes, The plays the thing, Hamlet by Shakespeare.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=quote%20the%20plays%20the%20thing&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CFUQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.enotes.com%2Fshakespeare-quotes%2Fplay-s-thing&ei=-YXrT46uC8Kg2gWVg9i1AQ&usg=AFQjCNEcXuLuMkrpF9sKwRwsssjaS3OMSw&sig2=NJcEz75msGISla6AOUgTkw

The Theme is interesting: Themes: family, murder and assassination, intrigue, deception.

Shakespeare Quote - "The plays the thing"

Hamlet:
I'll have grounds
More relative than this—the play's the thing
Wherein I'll catch the conscience of the King.

Hamlet - Act 2, Scene 2
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyWed Jun 27, 2012 6:49 pm

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Whaddy10
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
morf13


Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 52
Location : NJ

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 9:51 am

Heard back from the FBI regarding Manalli,and they could not locate a file on Manalli. However,they noted that they could not searc their entire file system because the FBI is in the middle of loading all of their paper records on file into computerized format. Thats probably why its taking so long for the FBI to release all of their Zodiac files to me.
Back to top Go down
trainmaster
Chief
trainmaster


Posts : 450
Join date : 2011-11-21

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 5:25 pm

'FBI is in the middle of loading all of their paper records on file into computerized format.

They are just doing that now??? I would have thought a project like that would have been done year ago.
However, the Fed Government is slow in getting around to that. They always talked about putting our records on microfiche - never did that either. I suppose money is an issue.

When they are through, you should have all they have and will release on Freddie Mertz. It will be worth it.

TRAINMASTER
--------------------------------------
"She was the last word in luxery and speed. Before the last voyage, she was declared "unsinkable" by her owners. The rich and famous chose to sail in her.
Her sinking was the worst shock the world ever had."

RMS LUSITANIA May 7, 1915
Back to top Go down
doranchak
Captain



Posts : 366
Join date : 2011-05-29

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 5:32 pm

The likely problem is that when you have thousands of pages of physical files that you want to scan into a computer, you can't do quick searches within the files for text like "Manalli" unless some kind of optical character recognition is performed on them. It's an inexact science especially with old documents that are handwritten or faded or otherwise difficult to understand.

So, there could be some pages in there about Fred, but without proper transcriptions of the scanned files' contents, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.
Back to top Go down
Theforeigner
Chief
Theforeigner


Posts : 880
Join date : 2010-03-06
Age : 68
Location : Denmark

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 7:11 pm

Info on a classified ad posted in the SF Chronicle Aug 27, 1976 saying:

"ZODIAC, your partner is in DEEP REAL ESTATE. You're next. The Imperial Wizard can save you. Surrender to him or I'll terminate your case. R.A."

can be found on this thread :

https://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t756p30-maupin-s-account-of-toschi-and-the-zodiac-letters#30208

Here is a copy of a post on that thread and my reply to it concerning Fred Manalli:

Seagull wrote:
On the last page of the article Tracers posted there is mention of a personals ad that appeared in the Chronicle. Here is the ad as published-

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Zodiacpersonalad

10-04-2010 Seagull, on zodiackiller.com, suggested that:
"the ad saying that Zodiac's partner is in Deep Real Estate I think would mean that the partner is dead, six feet under ground."



NOW!...I just realized that TWO DAY previously of this add, August 25, 1976, Fred Manalli died!!!

SO!...was Fred Manalli Zodiac's partner in crime???
And somone knew about it?


California Death Index, 1940-1997
about Fredric S Manalli
Name: Fredric S Manalli
Social Security #: 352264917
Sex: Male
Birth Date: 7 Mar 1935
Birthplace: Illinois
Death Date: 25 Aug 1976
Death Place: Sonoma

Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
morf13


Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 52
Location : NJ

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 8:23 pm

Wow Foreigner,I remember this thread and this classified AD. Really interesting as far as the timing and with Manalli's death. Will have to look at this closer. Thanks
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 10:13 pm

This just gets better and better. Seagull, you (at least I think it was you) mentioned that someone (in LE?) believed that Manalli and another person were responsible for the SRHMs... and after they were gone, there were no more murders. Do you know who the other person was?
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 10:22 pm

Good stuff TF. Weird ad, this is the first time I've heard about it.

Ok, I've been going through Manalli's Blaketia Sextet.

There are of course many references to murder and killing and death and some pretty abstract stuff that could be interpreted as "Zodiacesque". I was going to start with them but I found this interesting and have decided to go with it first.

One thing that seems evident to me is that Manalli models his characters on himself. Whether it's narcissism or limited imagination I can't say. But I'd go for both lol.

The description below is of the main character in the story "May Day". First of all various elements are similar to the description of Zodiac and some are, I think, of Manalli. I've included the pics of him sourced by Morf to illustrate. It would be interesting to see if the bit about dental work shows up in any army docs we might get.

The bit for me though is about the nose. The description of a once "Norman" shaped nose being flattened and twisted due to boxing jumped out at me for two reasons.

1. It solves the appearance of Manalli's apparently large nose with an explanation that may well be something that actually happened to him. I have shown what I think are differences in his photos regarding this. In the first image It appears that he has a very shallow, practically non existent, bridge. In the other photos the bridge appears to be deeper and actually present.

2. One of the first things I had floating around in my noggin concerning the Stine composite was possible reasons for the way the nose was drawn. One of my theories was that I wondered if it had been drawn that way to give it a more flattened appearance. The amended sketch certainly seems to have flattened the nose more. I also wondered if this was because the Zodiac had been a boxer or a football player.

Those are my thoughts on it. I may be drawing connections where there aren't any but why are they so easy to draw in the first place.

Fred Manalli - Page 20 May-da10
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
morf13


Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 52
Location : NJ

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyThu Jun 28, 2012 11:16 pm

Okay Trav, some good things you mention,but I cant make out the small red writing and examples from the book(too small). Also, with the photo comparisons, in page 1 of this thread,is the original pic posted by Seagull, which is from his college year.Its the most recent of ALL the pics, but its still fromlike 58/59 or around there. His lips look tight in it,which reminds me of the Zodiac sketch as does his chin & jaw. Like I said,its the most recent pic of Manalli that we can find but I know there HAS to be more someplace in the world, and I want to find one from 1969.

EDIT:

Actually, heres the pic and its from 57-
Fred Manalli - Page 20 Fredmanallipicture
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 6:25 am

Sorry bout that.

Here's a cropped version hopefully easier to see.

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Physic10
Back to top Go down
morf13
Admin
morf13


Posts : 6416
Join date : 2010-03-04
Age : 52
Location : NJ

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 1:45 pm

Theforeigner wrote:


Info on a classified ad posted in the SF Chronicle Aug 27, 1976 saying:

"ZODIAC, your partner is in DEEP REAL ESTATE. You're next. The Imperial Wizard can save you. Surrender to him or I'll terminate your case. R.A."

can be found on this thread :

https://zodiackillersite.forummotion.com/t756p30-maupin-s-account-of-toschi-and-the-zodiac-letters#30208

Here is a copy of a post on that thread and my reply to it concerning Fred Manalli:

Seagull wrote:
On the last page of the article Tracers posted there is mention of a personals ad that appeared in the Chronicle. Here is the ad as published-

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Zodiacpersonalad

10-04-2010 Seagull, on zodiackiller.com, suggested that:
"the ad saying that Zodiac's partner is in Deep Real Estate I think would mean that the partner is dead, six feet under ground."



NOW!...I just realized that TWO DAY previously of this add, August 25, 1976, Fred Manalli died!!!

SO!...was Fred Manalli Zodiac's partner in crime???
And somone knew about it?


California Death Index, 1940-1997
about Fredric S Manalli
Name: Fredric S Manalli
Social Security #: 352264917
Sex: Male
Birth Date: 7 Mar 1935
Birthplace: Illinois
Death Date: 25 Aug 1976
Death Place: Sonoma


I am still kicking this around. Anybody have any ideas or theories? I really have a hard time buying a Zodiac 'team' theory,but the timing of this AD is crazy as it relates to Manalli's death. Think about it,Manalli is killed the night of 8/25/76. The next day,8/26/76 is when most people would have learned about his death. It would be too late for somebody to put a personal ad into that day's paper(the day of the 26th),so it would have to start the following day,on the 27th,WHICH IT DID! That is downright spooky. Any attempt by police to find out who paid for or placed the AD?
Back to top Go down
trainmaster
Chief
trainmaster


Posts : 450
Join date : 2011-11-21

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 3:58 pm

I don't know about the ad - it could be pure coincidence.

I would return to the scene of the accident. WHY did Manalli do what he did?
To try to pass a car? Maybe someone put something in his coffee or something to induce a heart attack?
He had to swerve to avoid something?

We would have to try to obtain and read the coroner's report for anything on Manalli - was he intoxicated? Chance of foul play? The coronor's report would rule out most of the above. Getting ahold of it! Almost imossible!

Then, obtain the accident report and read it. A good chance.

The other driver survived - if she is still around and would talk, perhaps she could describe what took place to cause the accident.

The position of the vehicles would be of paramount importance in establishing what might have happened - that would be in the accident report.

Manalli was too poor to be in real estate. Was he is some sort of deep trouble with someone or LE? They did find those drawings relating to the murder of Kim Wendy Allen. Was Manalli interrogated yet?

Finally, is it possible Manalli was in such a frantic mind that he decided to "end it all" as he threatened to do in his letters? He could have been in such a state-of-mind that he didn't care who he took along, but I don't think that was the reason for the accident.

Where was the accident scene, again. Highway 12 and what? I would like to Google the area via street maps; I have travelled over that road many times.

Things to ponder.


Last edited by trainmaster on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:04 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : arthritis-spelling)
Back to top Go down
Seagull
Chief
Seagull


Posts : 1150
Join date : 2010-03-06
Location : No. California

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 4:17 pm

According to Manalli's death certificate the accident was on Hwy 12, 2,745 feet East of Merced Ave. The accident happened Aug. 24, 1976 at 8:30 pm. He died after midnight at 1:25 am to be precise, hence the Aug, 25th date of death. The newspaper article says he was eastbound on Hwy 12, so he was headed away from his home at the time. He lived at 6665 Sebastopol Ave. Sebastopol, the Shady Rest Trailer Park.

Back to top Go down
http://www.santarosahitchhikermurders.com
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 10:01 pm

So I was checking out Blaketia again and decided to check one of the references Manalli made to "the knights of colombus"and "Ku Klux Klan".

This is how I found out that Imperial wizard is a Klan Title.

Then I spotted this and thought....hmmm. interresting.

Once African Americans secured federal legislation to protect civil and voting rights, the KKK shifted its focus to opposing court-ordered busing to desegregate schools, affirmative action and more open immigration. In 1971, KKK members used bombs to destroy 10 school buses in Pontiac, Michigan.

EDIT: So maybe what I'm wondering is if the ad was Klan related and maybe they used zodiac for a code word (they did use codewords) for reference to activities involving bomb making or for a bomb maker, inspired by the actual Zodiac's bus bomb threats?

Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptyFri Jun 29, 2012 11:24 pm

So it would seems that nothing can be discussed - EVER - without it having some sort of Manalli/Zodiac connection.

I've been reading about Nathan Bedford Forrest. Yes, note the name.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Bedford_Forrest

General Bedford Forrest appears as a character in William Faulkner's 1943 short story "My Grandmother Millard and General Bedford Forrest and The Battle of Harrykin Creek." The Confederate general's engagements with a U.S. General Smith (presumably Maj. Gen. Andrew J. Smith) in northern Mississippi and southwestern Tennessee are part of the setting of that story and of Faulkner's 1938 novel "The Unvanquished." In Faulkner's 1942 collection "Go Down, Moses," the story "The Bear" refers to a plantation ledger entry recording the purchase of a 26-year-old slave in March 1856 for $265 "from N.B. Forest [sic]."

Forrest is credited with being one of the founding members, if not THE founding member, of the original incarnation of the KKK which he later disbanded.

EDIT: To add the obvious, subject matter of this nature, naturally involves extensive use of the words slaves & negroe

EDIT:

zodiac [ˈzəʊdɪˌæk]
n
1. (Spirituality, New Age, Astrology & Self-help / Astrology) an imaginary belt extending 8° either side of the ecliptic, which contains the 12 zodiacal constellations and within which the moon and planets appear to move. It is divided into 12 equal areas, called signs of the zodiac, each named after the constellation which once lay in it
2. (Spirituality, New Age, Astrology & Self-help / Astrology) Astrology a diagram, usually circular, representing this belt and showing the symbols, illustrations, etc., associated with each of the 12 signs of the zodiac, used to predict the future
3. Rare a complete circuit; circle
[from Old French zodiaque, from Latin zōdiacus, from Greek zōidiakos (kuklos) (circle) of signs, from zōidion animal sign, carved figure, from zōion animal]
zodiacal [zəʊˈdaɪəkəl] adj

KKK
The first Klan was founded in 1865 in Pulaski, Tennessee, by six veterans of the Confederate Army.[15] They named it after the Greek word kuklos, which means circle. The name suggests a circle or band of brothers[16]

EDIT:

Some visual zynchronicity

Fred Manalli - Page 20 170px-10

Three Ku Klux Klan members arrested in Tishomingo County, Mississippi, September 1871, for the attempted murder of an entire family.


EDIT: I should add that prior to the war Forrest was a slave master. IT's just as well his name wasn't Cherry. Lol

Fred Manalli - Page 20 344px-10


So what are my thoughts on this regarding Manalli. Well there's a good chance Manalli read Faulkner's book about Forrest. Both Manalli and Zodiac, whether they be one and the same or not, seem preoccupied with identity and also their own lack thereof. Zodiac, whoever he was, seemed to create more of the Zodiac than a name as I have previously stated, it was an identity, a persona. Manalli gives me the impression of doing the same by injecting himself into his characters and also by the general tone of his letters I can see him being the kind of man who wishes he was someone else, someone important.

Reading about Forrest, he certainly seems to be an imposing and fearsome character. Given to feats of murderous, and some might say, psychotic acts of bravery, or savagery depending which accounts of his deeds you read. His physical description alone might have connected with Manalli or Zodiac.

"In person he is six feet one inch and a half in height, with broad shoulders, a full chest and symmetrical, muscular limbs, erect in carriage, and weighs 185 pounds; dark gray eyes, dark hair, mustache, and beard worn upon the chin; a set of regular set teeth and clearly cut features," which altogether, makes him rather a handsome man for one forty-seven years of age.
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptySat Jun 30, 2012 1:23 am

Here's the part from Blaketia that had me looking at that stuff.

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Kkk10
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptySat Jun 30, 2012 1:37 am

Comments welcome on this one. Does anyone know what a tarbox is? There are many references to it being a name. The only other reference I can find for it, which makes sense, is from John Updike's novel "Couples" which is centred in the fictional town of Tarbox.

You may also note the homosexual references in this section. The biting buttocks bit got me but I don't think it all that stuff about Bundy came out till after Manalli was dead.

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Tarbox10
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptySat Jun 30, 2012 1:45 am

A rather unusual metaphor.

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Mechan10
Back to top Go down
traveller1st
Chief
traveller1st


Posts : 1408
Join date : 2011-11-27
Age : 50
Location : Northern Ireland

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 EmptySat Jun 30, 2012 2:19 am

From "A Day That Might Never Come"

Fred Manalli - Page 20 Berlin10

An obvious reference to this:-

Berlin ultimatum
In November 1958, Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev issued an ultimatum giving the Western powers six months to agree to withdraw from Berlin and make it a free, demilitarized city. At the end of that period, Khrushchev declared, the Soviet Union would turn over to East Germany complete control of all lines of communication with West Berlin; the western powers then would have access to West Berlin only by permission of the East German government. The United States, United Kingdom, and France replied to this ultimatum by firmly asserting their determination to remain in West Berlin and to maintain their legal right of free access to that city.

So it's a reasonable assumption, given Manalli's service dates and mentioning living in Germany and specifically referencing Berlin, that he was stationed there for this occurrence and has used the experience as part of his writing.

The one thing I can't get out of my is that theory, or suggestion, that the Timex watch found at the CJB murder scene my have been bought at a military PX in Europe.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content





Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fred Manalli - Page 20 Empty

Back to top Go down
 
Fred Manalli
Back to top 
Page 20 of 36Go to page : Previous  1 ... 11 ... 19, 20, 21 ... 28 ... 36  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Zodiackillersite :: Zodiac Suspects & POI's General Discussion :: All other Zodiac Suspects & POI's-
Jump to: