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Seagull
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PostSubject: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:02 pm

Fred Manalli was a suspect in at least one of the Santa Rosa Hitchhiker murders, that of Kim Allen. He quite possibly could have been a suspect in some of the others, too, I just don't know that for sure. Graysmith mentions him although not by name in his Zodiac books. Manalli is the Santa Rosa Junior College teacher who was killed in a vehicle accident in 1976.

I suppose because the SRHM, at one time, were thought to have been committed by Zodiac that Manalli has come into play as being a possible Zodiac suspect, too. I know Morf and others have wanted to see a picture of Manalli to be able to visually confirm whether or not he looked anything like the Zodiac composite.

I have finally tracked down a picture of the guy! This is from his senior year in college, 1957. Although it's a rather early picture there are certain features that don't change significantly in a person's looks. I think the length of his face, his hairline and the bushyness of his eyebrows tend to rule him out as looking like the Zodiac composite.




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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:48 pm

Thanks Seagull. I agree with your opinion on his features.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:06 pm

Is he the one on the right?

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:20 pm

Yes, he is the one on the right. Both the picture and the written part.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:18 pm


Thanks Seagull, great work as always:)
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:19 pm

Good work Seagull. Certainly some things of interest regarding Manalli.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:15 pm

Seagull wrote:
I think the length of his face, his hairline and the bushyness of his eyebrows tend to rule him out as looking like the Zodiac composite.

Six foot three is a bit tall for Z too I think. Someone would have noticed, Fouke should have.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:38 pm

Yes, 6'3" is too tall and at 185# he wouldn't have had a big stomach. Nor does he look a bit Welsh. Laughing

He looks good for murder in Sonoma County but not Zodiac.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:28 pm

I was able to buy a yearbook from Manalli's senior year in college. It's the University of Illinois Champaign Urbana 1957 Illio. The picture I posted above is from the yearbook. The blurb beside his picture says that he was in the fraternity Theta Chi. There is a picture of all the fraternity brothers in the yearbook but Manalli is not pictured with them nor is he named as not being in the picture. Don't know what is up with that, did he quit or maybe get kicked out???

Anyway, I did notice that the fraternity's logo, that is shown on what appears to be a lapel pin, looks an awful lot like the Zodiac crosshair symbol. I looked the fraternity up online and it seems they are no longer using this particular logo.

The Greek letters for Theta Chi are OX, with a small line in the center of the O. So the lapel pin pictured in the yearbook makes sense. Here is a current page for Theta Chi merchandise with the new logo.

http://www.thetachistore.com/thchigime.html

While I still don't think that Manalli was Zodiac, I do think that the lapel pin logo used by the fraternity back in the late '50's is a worthy find. Perhaps Zodiac got his inspiration for his logo from being in this fraternity?????

Here's the page in the yearbook.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:34 pm

Interesting stuff Seagull. Please refresh my memory(if it can be refreshed...really tired the last few days Very Happy )....how did he come to the attention of the police again? I know he was mentioned in the book,but I always am acurious how these POI's come into the limelight.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:50 pm

He came to the attention of the Sonoma County Sheriff's Office because a drawing or drawings were found among his belongs in his home when it was being cleared out by his ex-wife, Suzanne Carlson, and man named Don Emblen. The drawing/s were said to depict the torture murder of Kim Allen. How they knew that the drawings depicted a murder that occured 4+ years previous is unknown to me, perhaps the drawing was labeled.

Both Suzanne Carlson and Don Emblen are dead now. After the Manalli's divorced Suzanne married Don Emblen. Don had been Manalli's boss, so to speak, as he was the head of the department Manalli worked in at Santa Rosa Junior College. Suzanne also taught at the college.

Suzanne died of breast cancer in 1988 and Emblen died in 2009. There is a Sue Carlson scholarship at SRJC for english as a second language students at SRJC.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:39 am

Seagull wrote:
Fred Manalli was a suspect in at least one of the Santa Rosa Hitchhiker murders, that of Kim Allen. He quite possibly could have been a suspect in some of the others, too, I just don't know that for sure. Graysmith mentions him although not by name in his Zodiac books. Manalli is the Santa Rosa Junior College teacher who was killed in a vehicle accident in 1976.

I suppose because the SRHM, at one time, were thought to have been committed by Zodiac that Manalli has come into play as being a possible Zodiac suspect, too. I know Morf and others have wanted to see a picture of Manalli to be able to visually confirm whether or not he looked anything like the Zodiac composite.

I have finally tracked down a picture of the guy! This is from his senior year in college, 1957. Although it's a rather early picture there are certain features that don't change significantly in a person's looks. I think the length of his face, his hairline and the bushyness of his eyebrows tend to rule him out as looking like the Zodiac composite.





I am bumping this thread up. Trav is looking at the writing of Manalli and has found some things of interest in Manalli's writing that I agree with. In addition, look at this photo (mouth and chin)...if you throw a set of glasses on him, he does look pretty similar to the Zodiac sketch. Its worth a closer look, IMO. I already know that Seagull thinks he may be a suspect in the SR murders, so if so, maybe he should be more of a suspect in the Z murders? Although, if he was 6ft3, that sounds too tall. He IS THE GUY ON THE RIGHT IN THE PHOTOS,CORRECT?

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 9:59 am

Yes, he's the guy on the right!

I'm going through the letters I have to see if I can nail down some dates of where he was when. He and his wife were firespotters for CDF a few summers in the '60's, maybe into the very early '70's. If he can definitely be placed too far from the BRS scene, that alone might rule him out. I would think that July 4th would be a big day for firespotters and both Manalli and his wife would be on the job that day.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 11:00 am

Seagull, have you seen or read this book by Manalli????

Manalli, Fred S. Paradise, it's a nice place [story].Ts. moderate revision. 16p Shocked

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 11:26 am

I have sent for that story, hope to have it soon.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 11:43 am

Regarding where Manalli was the summer of 1969. It looks like Manalli did not work as a firespotter that summer. I have a letter written and postmarked from Santa Rosa July 9, 1969 and the letter does not say anything about working for CDF that summer. Also, there is a letter dated Aug. 27, 1969 where Manalli and his wife are visiting friends in SF. The end of August into September are prime firespotting months so I do not think that the both of them would be in SF at that time if they were working at that job that summer.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 5:47 pm

Ok I'm putting up what I have so far so I don't have an excitement overload. That's not sarcasm btw. I don't know what you will all make of this but I have to say this is kinda freaking me out lol.

I'm getting similarities off everything on this. The letters, the car door, citizen letter, count marco, the desk. That's how I noticed the stuff about the marco letter I've just posted over on the marco thread.

What you are seeing here is only a small part. A very small part, there are a lot of others to show and possible even better examples of these ones once I work my way through all 6 pages.

I spotted what I will call "the mystery Y" for now. It has a very specific construction and I've seen it before - I just haven't found it yet.

BTW if it has a red M beside it it's Manalli's handwriting


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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:06 pm

Wow Traveller! There are some definite similarities in the handwriting. I am very surprised. Can't wait to see what else you've found! Thanks for all your work and to Morf too for having the foresight to have you examine the handwriting.
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:15 pm

No problem. Thanks Morf for suggesting this one and thanks Seagull for having the stuff to look at. Great work.

This guys writing is weird because I can't compare it directly due to it being cursive but that doesn't seem to making a difference which is a bit spooky. The other thing you may notice is that the similarities that appear are mixed in with the cursive as if every so often there's a little zodiac thing dropped in a three stoke K here, a lowercase g there etc etc. It's as if they are hidden, or showing through.

I gotta say from something that on the surface didn't look like anything too hot it sure seems to have some hidden depths.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:43 pm

Thanks Trav, great work, will have to digest this. By the way, seems like Manalli has a very unusual or special lower case Z. Is there any lower case Z's written by Zodiac we can compare?

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:46 pm

Not directly I don't think but then there's always the thing at the bottom of the Bate's letters that could be interpreted as a combination of the 2 types of Z.

EDIT:

There's the z in Citizen at the bottom of the Badlands letter. Not a match to Manalli's but it doesn't look comfortable drawn to my eye. Actually a lot of zodiac's z's don't. They have a weird curve to them.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:51 pm

Manalli also has an unusual way of writing the word CONTACT,seems different from the rest of the words. Also, Manalli seems to have a weird mix of cursive & printed writing.

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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Tue May 29, 2012 6:59 pm

traveller1st wrote:
Not directly I don't think but then there's always the thing at the bottom of the Bate's letters that could be interpreted as a combination of the 2 types of Z.

EDIT:

There's the z in Citizen at the bottom of the Badlands letter. Not a match to Manalli's but it doesn't look comfortable drawn to my eye. Actually a lot of zodiac's z's don't. They have a weird curve to them.

Regarding the letter Z. My former married name, a few light years ago, had a Z in the middle. It is an awkward letter to write because it is seldom used in everyday writing. The first year it probably looked like a tree in the middle of my name! I did get very fluid with writing that Z though, it just comes with practice.

That might give us a clue that Zodiac didn't write the letter Z often and it wasn't in his regular name!
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PostSubject: Mystery y   Wed May 30, 2012 7:34 am

traveller1st wrote:
I spotted what I will call "the mystery Y" for now. It has a very specific construction and I've seen it before - I just haven't found it yet.

Trav,

I think you're referring to the y's from the desktop poem.

-tbz
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PostSubject: Re: Fred Manalli   Wed May 30, 2012 8:23 am

thebigZ wrote:
traveller1st wrote:
I spotted what I will call "the mystery Y" for now. It has a very specific construction and I've seen it before - I just haven't found it yet.

Trav,

I think you're referring to the y's from the desktop poem.

-tbz



Ironically I wasn't but after some checking last night it turns out I was except ... I wasn't. I had noted the similarities and would have used the y's from the desk as a comparison at some point. Except not for the mystery 'y' (singular).

This is where the irony comes in. I decided that what I was thinking of probably was in the desk poem - just not as a 'y' but as a lower case 'h' in two instances.

Here's a quick comp showing the y's against the word 'anyway' from the desk and the word 'yeoman' with the mystery 'y' compared against the two instances of the lower case 'h' from the desk.


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